9" question please help. This has got to be wrong?

Well as you can see from the pictures theres a crap load of money from currie sitting on my garage floor and I started on the rear gear instal about 40 min ago. Well I have to say this is wrong?

The one side adjuster is in about where I would think it should be? But the other side is not very far in like the other side. The preload is set pertty high in these pictures too.

I would just equally adjust them to get them sorta centered before I stabed the pinion and support in but The detroit is hitting the case if I go any further. See pictures.

Ok this is the first time I have done a 9" setup and dont think this is right. Even the lock tab wont sit flat and barely gets liek 2 turns before its starting to want to bend around the adjustment ring thats sticking out far.

Help... I would post this in Mod but most questions I ask there get two people answering them that are great and all but not much else in this type of q, and I know theres a few of you here running 9" ers...

Thanks

This one looks fine?

this one though is way further out

And this is why I cant move the carrier over any firther.

ok well thanks Clean-rc for your experience in this. So I guess this could be normal, I will find out tomorrow when I get the right bearing for the pinion support and fit the pinion in.

This really sucks though. I know PORC had no real way to tell what exact pinion support I had but I did tell them that it was the biggest Currie sells and it was for a strange/9+ case support thats the biggest that fits in that case. Not to mention we got the instal kits for the 35spline rear and the 31 front with same pinion support. But what they sent, niether pinion bearing is right, and the front carrier bearings are wrong also. Maybe a 27 spline?

In any case here I sit on like 5K worth of stuff and 4 bearings is holding up the show.....

Oh and Currie forgot or didnt mention that thier complete minus drop out 3rd, set up doesnt come with pinion support bolts. Errr

ROBERTK said:

In any case here I sit on like 5K worth of stuff and 4 bearings is holding up the show.....

Oh and Currie forgot or didnt mention that thier complete minus drop out 3rd, set up doesnt come with pinion support bolts. Errr

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Thats why WE limit our spending with Currie.... they never have good service after the sale...

Why would you spend $5000 on a low pinion 9"? You'd be better off with a True Hi 9 and the ring and pinion would have been set up.

Why didn't you have them do it (Scott, don't go there ) ?

Clean-RC said:

Thats why WE limit our spending with Currie.... they never have good service after the sale...

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I love you, man.

What he said but I won't be as polite. Currie blows, plainly.

cracker said:

Why would you spend $5000 on a low pinion 9"? You'd be better off with a True Hi 9 and the ring and pinion would have been set up.

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Just install the ring and run the copper line to the pre-drilled hole in the case. It may be easier that way but I can appreciate doing the set up if you can, even if it is a PITA from time to time.
From the look in the first picture, the 9" is going under an MJ; not to many issues with driveline angles. I can't tell if it's shaved or not, but the LP third member better allows the flat shaved area to be parallel with the ground. You can end up with more clearance under the pumpkin w/ a LP than w/ the HP. This is especially true with the longer drive shafts.

Besides all that, remember that this is a guy that keeps changing things he didn't get right the first time.
I'm thinking of a number......Mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm... I see an 8. Wait, yes, an 8; two 8s, that's right. I see a period; no it's a decimal, yes it's clear now, 8.8

You sometimes have to clearance that area of the pinion support when you get down into the 5.43 range.

well that 5000 is for both the front 9 and rear 9 both are low pinion. I was waiting to see what you all thought the rig was. Haha its a CJ-7. The rear we were going to do a hp9 but in all seriousness the LP is stronger. This rig is being built with a 383 TBI with a 700r4 and D300. The ultimate strength with in some reason was a concern.

Currie was only comish. to do the housings, the axles, and sell use the drop out unit and pinion support as well as exporer rear brake setup. On all those parts they really were very resonable. Now the detroits, R&P and install kits we saved about 600 total for the front and rear by going though PORC.

But we asked Many times ok besides a instal kit, gears adn locker this is complete. Oh yeah it is, was the answer every time assgas:

The pinion angles have to be concidered as with the front D300 output and the 700r4 tranny. they will hit with most HP with only 4" of lift (or so we are being told) as will the issue of oil pan and diff issues, again as were being told. This is a creation in progress and its all being done by research and not much else, beside $$.

As for having Currie setup the gears. Well I have done over a dozen others but never a 9" and heard how much easier they are then any of the others I have done. SO I wanted the experience and I really like knowing whats in something and how and why it is what it is, in side and out. As well as Never letting anyone do anything (litereally) on my rigs. Now I guess you could say currie had some hands in it, but I honestly do trust thier broken english back shop forman lol, He has been there for Years!

Anyways, today I will get the rest of the bearings and hopefully get both front and rear together and ready for 4link rear and front ?

CRASH said:

You sometimes have to clearance that area of the pinion support when you get down into the 5.43 range.

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Yeah thats what Clean-rc said but thats not what is interfering. Its the detroit hitting (see exact center of that red O), you can kinda see the mark on it from where I rotated the detroit and its left a scratch on it around it.

ROBERTK said:

I was waiting to see what you all thought the rig was. Haha its a CJ-7.

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Nevermind.
:sad1:

ROBERTK said:

The rear we were going to do a hp9 but in all seriousness the LP is stronger.

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:bs:

Stonger than a Currie High Pinio, YES. But a True Hi 9 (www.truehi9.com), with the thrust block, I think comparable if not stronger.

ROBERTK said:

Yeah thats what Clean-rc said but thats not what is interfering. Its the detroit hitting (see exact center of that red O), you can kinda see the mark on it from where I rotated the detroit and its left a scratch on it around it.

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Yes, I've had to clearance the pinion support for a detroit as well. they are bit larger than a standard 9" diff right there.

Give it some love with a grinder and you'll be fine.

cracker said:

:bs:

Stonger than a Currie High Pinio, YES. But a True Hi 9 (www.truehi9.com), with the thrust block, I think comparable if not stronger.

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Its my understanding that that trust block and 3rd bearing is needed just to keep it alive in high torque and strees conditions due to the pinion being forced away cause of the reverse cut on the rear? I have seen more issues with the high9 then the reg ole LP while doing research. What is your opinon on this?

Currie (of course) even touched on it while we were in there, and showed us some of thos "thrust block"s that had bent and such. Not to mention why would you want the back side of the gear to purposely have interferance with any stationary item when its under heavy distortion?

I dont know I guess this is alot like the hiem to rod end debates you see. or ford to chevy to dodge....

ROBERTK said:

Its my understanding that that trust block and 3rd bearing is needed just to keep it alive in high torque and strees conditions due to the pinion being forced away cause of the reverse cut on the rear?

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Yes and no (Andy please correct me if I am wrong) The high torque and large tires put extra load on a ring and pinion whether it is reverse cut or not. One of the benifits of the 9", whether HP or LP, the additional pinion support helps prevent the flex.

ROBERTK said:

I have seen more issues with the high9 then the reg ole LP while doing research. What is your opinon on this?

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I would love to see these issues. In all the research I have done (which hasn't been too too much) I have only heard of a broken Ring and Pinion but that could happen to anything.

ROBERTK said:

Currie (of course) even touched on it while we were in there, and showed us some of thos "thrust block"s that had bent and such. Not to mention why would you want the back side of the gear to purposely have interferance with any stationary item when its under heavy distortion?

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If the thrust block has bent, something else must have happened to allow for the ring and pinion to flex that much. Let us ASSume that it did bend under normal conditions, what would have happened without the thrust block? Would the Ring have been wasted? The pinion would not have flexed enough with the additional pinion support never mind the ring moving too much off of the carrier.

Food for thought. :wave:

cracker said:

Yes and no (Andy please correct me if I am wrong) The high torque and large tires put extra load on a ring and pinion whether it is reverse cut or not. One of the benifits of the 9", whether HP or LP, the additional pinion support helps prevent the flex.


:

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I'll let the TrueHi9 guys speak for themselves:

5. Running on the coast side. Why? Because we have no choice. No gear manufacturers in America have a machine set up to cut them the other way. Can it be done? Possibly, but the cost of building the machine couldn't be offset with enough volume just supplying the offroad community. Can it be done overseas? Probably, but then you have a lesser quality gear set and most of the increased cost.

6. Are all high pinion rears running on the coast side of the gears? Yes. Is running on the coast side weaker? Sure. Can it be overcome? Yes. Why is it weaker, the teeth are the same size? There has been reference to the concave/convex shape of the teeth but when the ring gear is convex the pinion is concave and vice versa plus this curve in most Ford 9" and Dana 60 ring gear teeth is pretty slight. So the answer lies in the fact that the drive sides of the teeth are at close to a 90 degree angle to the direction they're pushing which doesn't create most of the ring and pinion horizontal separation forces associated with running on the coast side. What happens when the ring and pinion separate is the teeth run tip to tip instead of center of tooth to center of tooth. Can we control these separation forces? Sure. Just think of holding the pinion head on both ends of it with a 3rd bearing compared to holding it with just 2 bearings when these separation forces are at work. Now try to control the ring gear forces 3 inches away from where they are occuring instead of with a thrustblock like heavy duty rearends use including the monster trucks you see jumping and landing throttled up. I've had monster truck 3rd members in my shop and believe me they have a thrustbolt. People have called me with busted high pinion rear Dana 60's that have two distinct wear patterns on the teeth, one where they normally run and one where they run when they are under a load which is at the tooth tips where there is less material. The thrustblock in our differential virtually eliminates this ring gear deflection. Add that to the fact that a Dana 60 starts out with either less tooth thickness or less overall tooth contact and which do you think is going to break first?

In the 70's I had a C-mod camaro...broke many 12 bolt GM gearsets...went to a 9" at the advice of Bo Laws. Broke a couple of ring gears...went to the thrust block and never broke another. So it makes a difference. Helps keep the ring gear from deflecting.

I spoke to Hi9 a couple of week ago & they said that to date they hadn't had a single failure.

In regards to the thrustblock, depending on use, torque, etc., it's possible that a Hi9 could go a lifetime without ever utilizing the thrustblock, which only comes into play under extreme loads.

Considering the clearance, strength & cost of a Hi9, I can't imagine buying an LP9.
This season alone I'd probably have gone through 2 or 3 driveshafts if not for Hi9.

Paul

cracker said:

Yes and no (Andy please correct me if I am wrong) The high torque and large tires put extra load on a ring and pinion whether it is reverse cut or not. One of the benifits of the 9", whether HP or LP, the additional pinion support helps prevent the flex.



I would love to see these issues. In all the research I have done (which hasn't been too too much) I have only heard of a broken Ring and Pinion but that could happen to anything.


f the thrust block has bent, something else must have happened to allow for the ring and pinion to flex that much. Let us ASSume that it did bend under normal conditions, what would have happened without the thrust block? Would the Ring have been wasted? The pinion would not have flexed enough with the additional pinion support never mind the ring moving too much off of the carrier.

Food for thought. :wave:

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I was under the understanding that the thrust block and the third pinion bearing was to help control the add deflection that the gear set has due to the coast side driving the assembly. So the ring gear is more apt (more so with more torque and stress) to separate from eachother. Hence the added need of it? Then the pinion needs the bearing to help control its deflection.

Since this 9" is all new to me I could BE WAY OFF!

So in the 3 bearing support does it also use the "daytona" large bearing? Or just three reg bearings?

ROBERTK said:

.........Currie (of course) even touched on it while we were in there, and showed us some of thos "thrust block"s that had bent and such. Not to mention why would you want the back side of the gear to purposely have interferance with any stationary item when its under heavy distortion?

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Well, you didn't really expect them to say "theirs is better than ours" did you?........Hans

For what it's worth I'm working on a 9" nodular out of a top alcohol dragster. It has a single thrust block and it's been rubbing quite a bit, 3000HP and big slicks'll do that. I think the thrust block adds quite a bit to the durability.