balljiont adjusting sleeve shatered

I raised the knuckle with a bottle jack. started torqueing lower nut to 70LB then I insterted the top ADJUSTING SLEEVE at about 20 LB (not even half way in) the thing shatered in 5 peices!! WTF? what am i doing wrong???. I got out the broken stuff and tried it with the 2nd sleeve. SAME THING!, Shatered! JEEZ road blocks like this are not good


FYI, i have Chevy ford hysteer hybrid.

Huh???

Sorry, but I'm lost. What is a ball joint adjusting sleeve?

its the kinda of a threded insert that goes into the opening of the yoke, (the top one) the sleeve is threaded on the outside and smooth in the inside. and you need a 4 prong socket to tighten it down.

I checked everything. to make sure all the threads where not damaged or anything like that. Before I started to install this, i went ahead and insterted the sleeve inside the yoke and it went in like a glove, i tightened it down all the way to the end of the threads with my finger. so i know I dont have messed up threads.

Gotcha.

The insert goes into the knuckle (yoke) first, while it's off the vehicle. It's nothing but a tapered sleeve to match the taper on the balljoint stud. It is NOT an adjusting sleeve. Also, be sure you remove the old one before trying to screw the new one in place. You don't torque it down, either -- if not too late, take note of how deep the old one sits and just screw the new one down to the same point.

Then set the knuckle in place and tighten up the nuts.

if not too late, take note of how deep the old one sits and just screw the new one down to the same point

Click to expand...

Eagle, I wouldnt see the mark from the old insert because this is a brand new axle with new yokes. also how you told me to do this contradicts
this (of POR forum) which was the one I fallowed that resulted in my inserts exploding.

KarmirXJ said:

also how you told me to do this contradicts
... this (of POR forum)which was the one I fallowed that resulted in my inserts exploding.

Click to expand...

Well, just a few weeks ago I helped one of the guys in the NAC change the ball joints on his XJ and I set the inserts. His went together with no problems. You followed some advice you found on another site and yours exploded. Guess which way I think is the better way to do it?

Are these the sleeves that will allow you to adjust up to 2* of camber? If so, what brand are they, cuz I'm gettin' ready to purchase these in the next few weeks. Sounds like I may have to make my own.

Sean

piccs please I have no Idea what you guys are refering to and it sounds intresting

You are referring to the split ring sleeve. They usually went into the bottom of the knuckle anytime I've seen them. It's also important to thread these in to match the taper of the ball joint stud. They thread in so that the boss depth (the raised parts of the split ring) measures 0.206 (5.23mm) to the flats of the seat. These split rings serve as a means of adjustment to balance/equalize the knuckle within the yoke that it pivots in.

If it is adjusted too deep, the bottom ball joint taper will seat well before the top one. If it's not adjusted deep enough the knuckle may rub against the lower ball joint housing causing damage or premature wear.

This is why it's important to have the split ring installed correctly. I just put all new ball joints on my D30 and I broke out the dial depth gauge for this and everything went smoothly, and looked well balanced.

If the split ring installs differently on your axle/knuckle I would strongly recommend that you find out the specs. for the depth adjustment regarding your particular axle.

HTH,

Mark

Mark --

What's the source of your depth info? I'm not questioning it -- sounds like it makes sense -- but after seeing this thread I looked up ball joint replacement in the 2000 FSM and they don't even mention the sleeves, let alone a depth spec for them.

Eagle,

Surprisingly enough that depth adjustment is mentioned in the haynes manual. I don't remember the section or page number, I'll have to look when I get home. They mention it in one of their photo captions showing how to properly gauge the split ring for depth in the knuckle. Of course this measurement is for the stock D30 axle.

However, after studying the .pdf from POR.....

The MAJOR difference here is that on a D30 (what I saw during my ball joint fun) the split ring threads into the bottom of the knuckle itself. The ball joints are pressed into the yoke and not the knuckle. On his axle and according to the .pdf he reffered to, the split ring threads into the axle yoke itself, and the ball joints are pressed into the knuckle. The design of this axle has "both" ball joints being the load bearing joints.

On the D30 only the bottom ball joint is load bearing because it is pressed in from the bottom. The top one is pressed in from the top and would pop out if it had to bear load. It's as though the mounting system is completely upside down on his axle but it makes sense looking at the picture, I can see how it is a bit more rugged than a D30. I digress...

On his axle he must torque down the bottom ball taper FIRST and then torque the split ring itself into the yoke and onto the taper for the upper ball joint. If the split ring is breaking I'd say there's either a quality defect in their manufacture or there's a different problem, i.e. threads binding in the yoke or the 4 prong tool is defective.


This leads me to my question for KarmirXJ:

Is the 4 prong split ring tool a quality tool? (not homemade from an old socket) homemade will work for an application like the D30 where you set it and forget it. In your application it is very important for the tool to engage all 4 bosses on the split ring simultaneously to transfer all the torqing forces equally or it will bind and crack. You could probably lube (very lightly) the threads with grease to help also, but before installing any split ring it should be tested for binding in the threads. When you thread the ring in it pushes down against the upper ball joint taper spreading the ring apart making it harder to turn, 70FtLbs should build up quick. Care should also be taken to make sure the taper is going into the ring very straight. Then when you crank down the top nut (100FtLbs) you force the taper into the ring even tighter.

Mark

I missed the part about it not being a stock axle. My bad -- sorry

Eagle, thanks for the enormous research effort
Yes I am using a Balljoint socket from MAC TOOLS. (~$20)
the problem is the damn split ring cracks not even half way down the threads, so I got like 1/2 of split ring still sticking out of the yoke, there is no way I can tighten the nut over the ring it will demolish it, I called tri county gear today and they told me that i might be using a lower ball joint for the upper, since the lower one a bit bigger (thicker) it would explain my problem, but what gets me is that the stud has a hole through it for the cotter pin, that should be the upper one,


EAGLE, I am going to get my friends DIGI camera tonight I will post many pics of everything so you can get a better pic of whats going on,


Thanks for your effort eagle:worship:

Eagle,

As promised, the measurement for the D30 split ring is found in the 1984 to 2000 Haynes manual. Page 10-6 Steering knuckle installation.

I'm actually surprised it's not in the FSM.

Anyway I've been long winded enough. I'm going back to watching Monster Garage, Jesse James is converting a Corvette to 4X4 this thing is pretty slick.

Mark