What "modern" engine to use?

Ok, I've done a bit of searching here and haven't seen anything that really gets to my desires. I've got an MJ with no drivetrain and I would love to install something with POWER! I've driven a few 4.0L xj's and although it is a good engine, it really lacks at speed. As I've read a few others report, towing pretty much anything on the highway with 35's and 4.88 gears just doesn't cut it. Long grades in Nebraska, passes in CO, etc. it lacks! I could do a stroker 4.0L, but I don't even have a block to start with and I would rather do some sort of late model engine with a good solid automatic tranny. Anybody got suggestions? The new Hemi with whatever tranny comes with that might be a good choice, but cost is always a bit of a factor and I'm afraid that would be a bit much. How about the 4.7L v-8's from the WJ's? Are they any good? What tranny came in them? They started those in '99, so I could have half a chance at getting one in a recycling yard. I've read that Crash was suggesting some sort of a Lexus 4.7 V-8 with an AW4 tranny, but I know NOTHING about that engine. I'm used to the AW4 auto tranny, but feel that it could use another gear between 3rd and OD at least with the 4.0L. So, shoot me some REAL engine/tranny options and say why they would be a good choice. Jeff

I know the WJ 4.7L came with a 5 spd from '02 up to now in the WK's. I imagine that the 4.7L had the 5 spd from '99 up but I'm only sure about the '02 to current.

my .02

Hemi

-Red

It's pretty tough to beat a Ford Triton 5.4 with an auto tranny and the T-case out of the same rig. The heads are a bit wide, but they should fit. Go to the dealer and drive a 3 valve per cylinder model. You'll like it. 305 HP.

The only downfall might be the T-case output, as it's a slip yoke. I'm sure you could do an RE-like hack and tap to get it back to a normal fixed output, or just bolt an Atlas in......

The 4.7 Toyota motor is now using a 5 speed, but they were using a version of the AW-4 for several years. The older units are 245 HP, the new ones are 282.

The Hemi would also be nice. I think it has the most standardized drivetrain of all of them, Dodge hates change. I think the girth might get you, though.

I don't recommend Chevrolet products to anyone, so you are on your own there. However, Parts Mike has a very clean supercharged 3.8 out of a POntiac GTP in his Wrangler, and it positively SCOOTS.

Helpful?

If you are starting fresh without a motor/trans etc. then it's hard not to want a fuel injected Chevy 30 and 700R4 trans. A Chevy 4.3L fuel injected motor and 4L60E 95'+ isn't a bad motor either. I has this combo in my 94' Wrangler and it was very fast with 33" tires and hp30/8.8 with 4.88 gears. I had a Crane Cam and headers to give a little more power as well. That Wrangler just flew.

A Chevy drivetrain will be cheapest as is a Ford 302 if you are so inclined to going with a Ford drivetrain. What's your budget? The S-10 blazers even used a 231 t-case, although there were some difference, so a 4.3L Vortec motor with a 4L60E tranny and 231 t-case should give you a good, reliable, and lightweight drivetrain. If you are after 275+ hp, then get a Chevy 350 and have some fun with building it how you like.

CRASH said:

I don't recommend Chevrolet products to anyone, so you are on your own there. However, Parts Mike has a very clean supercharged 3.8 out of a POntiac GTP in his Wrangler, and it positively SCOOTS.

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I just bought my wife a 98' Pontiac GP GTP and it's nice and fast. I likey. :laugh3: It's a front wheel drive vehicle though, so that puts a damper on things right?

Troy

What's your budget? Wiring skills? Fab skills? It's hard to look beyond the late model Chevy engines because of the aftermarket support.
advanceadapters.com
Jeep on!
--Pete

ComancheClub.com

Big Red said:

I just bought my wife a 98' Pontiac GP GTP and it's nice and fast. I likey. :laugh3: It's a front wheel drive vehicle though, so that puts a damper on things right?

Troy

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Yes, Parts Mike had to convert his Wrangler to front wheel drive.

It's great in the snow now.

Big Red said:

...a 4.3L Vortec motor with a 4L60E tranny and 231 t-case should give you a good, reliable, and lightweight drivetrain.

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That is what I would do.
A V-8 (350) set up using the automatic trans and such ar too long and makes a rear drive shaft almost imposible.
I tried to stuff that set up into a CJ-5 years ago and ended up using a 4 speed man. trans.
Go with the 4.3 chevy or even the 4.6 out of a V-8 explorer.

The Ford 5.0 is a realistic option too. Cheap, fuel injected, good after-market support, 300hp with bolt-on upgrades, and about the smallest of the decent V-8'S. Novack makes and adapter for the 5.0 to the AW4.

Why don't use the 4.7L Power Tech that comes in the WJ's, The tranny is a 45 RFE with 5 speed. I know, it only have 235 hp's but that engine moves the WJ's pretty fast.
If you're lucky you can get the HO version and there you will have 260 hp's. I don't have a clue on prices though so I can say nothing about that.
Also it would be nice to have a OEM motor inside an old MJ.

HTH

I'm not a big fan of any of the newer V-8's.

The Ford 5.4 hits its peek 300HP@5000 and peak torque of 365@3750. Then the Dodge with 345HP@5400 and peak torque of 375@4200. I haven't driven the Ford, but the Dodge seems to come on way to late for me. I guess some extremely low gears or driving around in 1st would be ok.

I like the older v-8's better. The Ford 5.8 and Dodge 5.9 feel like they have a much better low end torque which I think is more fun driving on the street.

Maybe I'm still dreaming of yesteryear, but I would go with a Dodge 5.9 if you could talk me out of the 6. The year I decided to get an XJ ('93) I went wheeling with an XJ running 35's and a 360 dodge. I was drooling and haven't stopped.

Does anyone know if Ray Pili is still around. I think his was a 318.

how bout the Shortstar V6 or Ecotec that a lot of the comp buggys are using?

or rotary... :wierd:

When you've decided...I can take you as far as your wallet can go :laugh3:

Using any OBDII + era engines for swapping can be extremely challenging due to the fairly complex array of sensors involved, and low level of aftermarket parts. If your state emissions allow it, I would consider this since I believe this is one of the best balances of HP/TQ, driveability, ease of swap, availability of parts, and aftermarket support:


Ford 351W short block from a '95+ F150 or Bronco
Complete 87-93 5.0 SEFI injection system (requires specific lower manifold for 351)
Proffesionally prepped AOD or better yet small block pattern ZF 5 speed
Ford NP205, NP208 or other t-case of choice.

An 87-93 SEFI on a fresh 302 with some of the plethora of performance goodies out there would probably be more than sufficient as well for a little less money than a 5.8.

TPI 350 w/MAF or a slightly (and I do mean slightly) tweaked 5.0 HO. Parts are readily available-EVERYWHERE. Don't even go with a 6cyl. I don't care what it is. If you're not quite happy with a 4.0, what makes anyone think you'd be happy with a 4.3? That lexus motor is sweet, but spendy and difficult to find parts in stock at the Napa in Montrose I'm becoming quite partial to the WRX STi motor, but I'd never put it in a jeep.

Oh yeah, there's no replacement for displacement.

2JZ-GTE out of a 93-98 MKIV Supra......

These engines stock can handle 900rwhp and with just the stock TT setup you can make 450rwhp with a few mods. Theu are a bullitproof as they come. Best part is its an inline 6 and only 3.0L, so you have room unlike alot of other engines.

Also a plus, Guess what auto tranny Supras use? Thats right AW4 auto tranny. You can go to a place called BoostLogic and they can rebuild a stock AW4 to handle up to 700rwhp and they will change the shift points too.

So you could actually have an engine every bit as reliable as the 4.0L, still be an inline 6, be even smaller than the 4.0, is light weight, Can handle up to 900rwhp with stock internals, can make 450 rwhp off the stock twin turbos AND bolts to the AW4. What more could you ask for?

Downside...its pricey.

I am doing this one day though.

1993 MKIV 2JZ-GTE thats BPU (Basic performance mods)



Stay TT because the first turbo spools fast and early in the RPMs and the second kicks in at around 3500 rpms. While if you go single turbo it can make well over 1000rwhp, but the bigger turbo you go the higher the rpms for it to kick in. Just get a boost controller and a few other things and you'll be seeing 400+rwhp easy. You can buy used spare factory turbos with low miles for as cheap as $300 a set.

They also make a 2JZ-GE, which is the non-turbo (220 hp) version in all kinds of Lexus (IS300, GS300, and others) car and a few Toyotas.

Cummins 4BT

http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread.php?t=362348&highlight=totm

BrettM said:

how bout the Shortstar V6 or Ecotec that a lot of the comp buggys are using?

or rotary... :wierd:

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Or the "New Star" that Dustin posted on Pirate...around 300 ponies and tiny.

seanR said:

A V-8 (350) set up using the automatic trans and such ar too long and makes a rear drive shaft almost imposible.
I tried to stuff that set up into a CJ-5 years ago and ended up using a 4 speed man. trans.

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That is true in a CJ-5. But an XJ has a CONSIDERABLY longer wheelbase (well over a foot longer), and the rear shaft would not be a problem.

ZachMan said:

2JZ-GTE out of a 93-98 MKIV Supra......

These engines stock can handle 900rwhp and with just the stock TT setup you can make 450rwhp with a few mods. Theu are a bullitproof as they come. Best part is its an inline 6 and only 3.0L, so you have room unlike alot of other engines.

Also a plus, Guess what auto tranny Supras use? Thats right AW4 auto tranny. You can go to a place called BoostLogic and they can rebuild a stock AW4 to handle up to 700rwhp and they will change the shift points too.

So you could actually have an engine every bit as reliable as the 4.0L, still be an inline 6, be even smaller than the 4.0, is light weight, Can handle up to 900rwhp with stock internals, can make 450 rwhp off the stock twin turbos AND bolts to the AW4. What more could you ask for?

Downside...its pricey.

I am doing this one day though.

1993 MKIV 2JZ-GTE thats BPU (Basic performance mods)

Stay TT because the first turbo spools fast and early in the RPMs and the second kicks in at around 3500 rpms. While if you go single turbo it can make well over 1000rwhp, but the bigger turbo you go the higher the rpms for it to kick in. Just get a boost controller and a few other things and you'll be seeing 400+rwhp easy. You can buy used spare factory turbos with low miles for as cheap as $300 a set.

They also make a 2JZ-GE, which is the non-turbo (220 hp) version in all kinds of Lexus (IS300, GS300, and others) car and a few Toyotas.

Click to expand...

That almost looks like an XJ engine bay...

How about the aluminum V8 out of a range rover, small, light weight.
I used to have a aluminum 215 CI v8 out of a 61 buick skylark in my flatty. The entire assembled engine weighs 300 lbs. I built mine up pretty well and was making an estimated 300 horse power, without a stroker kit. Fun stuff. The early rover motors were the same engines, stroked and with EFI.