hp60/coilover swap on the XJ...

[ArcticXJ]

Mounting coilovers to a unibody sucks. So...
Here's a few shots of whats been going on with the M.I.A. supafly cherokee:

The general idea here was to design a strut tower style tie in bar that would connect to two shock hoops, and tie into the frame for rigidity:
http://images.snapfish.com/34452%3B6323232%7Ffp3%3B%3Dot%3E2344%3D739%3D%3A78 %3DXROQDF%3E232398479%3B%3B98ot1lsi

Noah, the mad scientist. Here you can see the very bottom of the shockhoops/frame plates, and the general suspension setup.
http://images.snapfish.com/34452%3B6323232%7Ffp64%3Dot%3E2344%3D739%3D%3A78%3 DXROQDF%3E23239847%3A3952ot1lsi

14 bolt. Not toooo wide.
http://images.snapfish.com/34452%3B6323232%7Ffp64%3Dot%3E2344%3D739%3D%3A78%3 DXROQDF%3E23239847%3A3956ot1lsi

Some test fitting, and preliminary mock up of the coilover axle mounts.
http://images.snapfish.com/34452%3B6323232%7Ffp64%3Dot%3E2344%3D739%3D%3A78%3 DXROQDF%3E232398479%3B%3B%3A9ot1lsi

A better view of the aforementioned, and a complete look as to the design of the shockhoop system. The coilovers wont actually mount in the hoops themselves, rather up on the strut tower bar. The shock hoops actually serve most of their purpose as a structural reenforcement, tying the system into the unibody, and adding rigidity to the front end.
http://images.snapfish.com/34452%3B6323232%7Ffp63%3Dot%3E2344%3D739%3D%3A78%3 DXROQDF%3E232398479%3B%3B%3B%3Aot1lsi

Every once in a blue moon, Professer Noah will accidentally lay down a half decent bead. This is one of the uprights that ties the strut bar into the top of the "frame" rails.
http://images.snapfish.com/34452%3B6323232%7Ffp3%3B%3Dot%3E2344%3D739%3D%3A78 %3DXROQDF%3E23239847%3A3959ot1lsi

More to follow....

[ArcticXJ]

Shock hoop, up close. You can see where the frame tie-ins are, as well as the tie-in to the top of the fenderwell. The strut tower bar runs through a cutout in the upper fender well (which on an XJ is structural, and load bearing) and mates to the hoop itself. 1/4" (or so, not positive) plate is then welded around the cutout, and to the tubing, thus tieing the fenderwell into the shock hoop/strut bar assembly.
http://images.snapfish.com/34452%3B6323232%7Ffp63%3Dot%3E2344%3D739%3D%3A78%3 DXROQDF%3E23239847%3A3962ot1lsi

A better look from the top side at what I was referring to with the plate being welded around the tube, and to the fender.
http://images.snapfish.com/34452%3B6323232%7Ffp64%3Dot%3E2344%3D739%3D%3A78%3 DXROQDF%3E23239847%3A3965ot1lsi

Side view of whats going on.
http://images.snapfish.com/34452%3B6323232%7Ffp47%3Dot%3E2344%3D739%3D%3A78%3 DXROQDF%3E23239847%3A55%3C8ot1lsi

Passenger side control arm bracketry.
http://images.snapfish.com/34452%3B6323232%7Ffp58%3Dot%3E2344%3D739%3D%3A78%3 DXROQDF%3E23239847%3A5638ot1lsi

Driver side axle bracketry. Some trickery going on here as well. "A confined space" would be an understatement. Here the over-the-diff truss is visable, as is it's clever incorporation. The next pic is cooler...
http://images.snapfish.com/34452%3B6323232%7Ffp64%3Dot%3E2344%3D739%3D%3A78%3 DXROQDF%3E23239847%3A3969ot1lsi

This is a trick little upward-swiveling peice that will rotate up and out of the way to remove the diff cover. We were contemplating the incorporation of a complete poison spyder-like rock ring into this. And for some extra bling, a small gas strut like you'd find on a rear hatch mounted inside the diff housing that would automatically lift the diff cover up out of your way as soon as the bolts were removed. :D
http://images.snapfish.com/34452%3B6323232%7Ffp47%3Dot%3E2344%3D739%3D%3A78%3 DXROQDF%3E23239847%3A564%3Aot1lsi

Welp, thats about all for now. Next week, I'll have pics of the strut tower bar tying into the front bumper, through the grill shell. :) Goodbye hood latches, hello hood pins.

[xjj33p3r]

Awesome setup. I really like the front Diff cover design.

[ArcticXJ]

Kinda cool, huh. I reeeealy wanna do the gas strut that I mentioned above the last photo! :D That'd be about the jeep equivalent of a platnum' chizzain and gold teef. :roflmao:

[xjj33p3r]

Do you have any type of sub-frame for those heavy axles? Or will the stock control arm mounts and leaf springs mounts do fine?

[ArcticXJ]

The control arm mounts arent stock. Theyre beefy, and welded to 18" of 1/4" angle iron that is partially sleeving the frame and serving as a mount for the current tranny/t-case x-member. Regardless, its all going to be strengthened though.

As far as the stock leaf mounts..... :roflmao: Yeah, those are garbage. The fully dressed 14bolt weighs 500 pouns. :D The front 60 isnt much less. There's no way in hell I'd wheel this thing hard without first going and fabbing up some subframe sleeving/cross members. Ive just got too little money, and too little time to do it all at once.

[xjj33p3r]

Good golly those are some heavy suckers. But that's good to hear that the body side mounts are reenforced for the time being. I don't think those stock leaf mounts could handle the extra 400 lbs without some type of "help" :D

[xjj33p3r]

Oh, and is there going to be a removeable center section for that strut tower? I would deam it useful if you'd ever have to take the cover off :D

[ArcticXJ]

No. Im just gonna run it till it pops. ;)















No, really though Ive got some flanges that are going to be spliced in just inside the uprights.

[XJ_ranger]

http://images.snapfish.com/34452%3B6323232%7Ffp47%3Dot%3E2344%3D739%3D%3A78%3 DXROQDF%3E23239847%3A55%3C8ot1lsi


what happens if you have to remove part of the engine? or pull the head to change a gasket?

i am thinking through my "cage" and want to do something similar to this when i make my cage, but worry about working in the engine bay with the welded in spanner.

[bj-666]

http://images.snapfish.com/34452%3B6323232%7Ffp47%3Dot%3E2344%3D739%3D%3A78%3 DXROQDF%3E23239847%3A564%3Aot1lsi

This design looks kinda cool but i don't see it having any real strength increase. (the way it looks to work is those 4 bolts hold it to the diff and the one bolt holds it to the bridge) seems to me your relying on the strength of 1\4" flat stock at a spot only a little over and inch wide. With all that being said my bridge only ties into the tubes and it has been fine.

[ArcticXJ]

what happens if you have to remove part of the engine? or pull the head to change a gasket?
:wave:
No, really though Ive got some flanges that are going to be spliced in just inside the uprights.

[ArcticXJ]

And for the rest who are wondering, YES the over engine truss portion WILL be removable.

[SeanP]

CO's on an XJ are sooooo gay

[ArcticXJ]

I know. Fags.

Almost as gay has hummer rims.

[XJ_ranger]

i dig the bridge grabing the diff cover...

i made my bridge out of channel, and set it to be flat when the pinion is 13* up, so the angle presents a problem for me to grab the diff cover bolts like i had wanted...

im not sure that the pivot helps you much other than the bling factor it seems that the slop in the sleeve and bolt would be a hinderance and not help much?

someday i will be cool enough to do this... - maybe

[ArcticXJ]

Jeep is finally sitting on it's own weight. CO's are mounted and good. Steering linkage done, 'cept for drag link needs to be shortened. Oh and theres no trackbar... yet. :D
Pics in the morning.

[Lincoln]

CO's on an XJ are sooooo gay

Coming out of the closet finally? :D

[JeepFreak21]

Coming out of the closet finally? :D

Where have you been?
http://www.naxja.org/forum/showthread.php?t=19808
Billy :D

[SeanP]

bwahahahahaha!!!!

The wonders of the internet...everything gets cached.

lookin good. I still owe you some completed pictures of my front end.

Billy, been turning wrenches on the chevy. Wanna stop by?

SeanP

[ArcticXJ]

I swear the man has more links-for-the-occasion than trailer park barbeque. :roflmao:

[ArcticXJ]

http://homepage.mac.com/noahlmil/images/nolan_1.jpg

http://homepage.mac.com/noahlmil/images/nolan_2.jpg

http://homepage.mac.com/noahlmil/images/nolan_3.jpg

Yes, thats 1.5" DOM, that is... you guessed it... .250" wall. BEEF!
http://homepage.mac.com/noahlmil/images/nolan_5.jpg

http://homepage.mac.com/noahlmil/images/nolan_6.jpg

http://homepage.mac.com/noahlmil/images/nolan_7.jpg

[xjj33p3r]

Hot stuff dude.

[tealcherokee]

im jelous of the steering....let alone the rest :)

[JeepFreak21]

It almost looks like you'd have better angles if you hadn't bent the trackbar like that. Am I seeing things or was there other reasoning behind it?
Billy

[Capt. Nemo]

It almost looks like you'd have better angles if you hadn't bent the trackbar like that. Am I seeing things or was there other reasoning behind it?
Billy

The tracbar needs to clear the pumpkin when the driver's side of the axle flexes up.

[Lincoln]

Artic,

Why didn't you go ahead and spend the few bills on high steer arms? It would have been much easier in the long run.

[ArcticXJ]

It almost looks like you'd have better angles if you hadn't bent the trackbar like that. Am I seeing things or was there other reasoning behind it?
Billy
The angles are almost perfect as is. Whether or not the bar has one, or many bends in it has no relevancy. The TB can have a loopty-loop in it or be shaped like a corkscrew and it wouldnt matter, as long as the two mounting points will droop in the same arc. I.E. they are as close as possible to parallel, and length. In the picture, if you notice the orange strings strung from point to point of the TB and tie rod ends, you'll see theyre near perfect. Somehow this confuses a lot of people, because they look at only the angle of the rod at the joints. Its the overall angles that have to match to avoid deathwobble/bumpsteer.

[ArcticXJ]

Artic,

Why didn't you go ahead and spend the few bills on high steer arms? It would have been much easier in the long run.
Lincoln,

[Violin Music][Pity Party] Youre right. However Ive just spent so much damn money already, and am so far beyond my budget for this that luxury parts like highsteer would push me way too far into the red. At this point, its been down for over 3 months and all I want anymore is just to get the fawking thing out of the shop and driving. I may have forgot to mention that this is my daily driver. I have no other means of transpo, and ive been catching rides to get groceries and to work since April.

C'mon, I mean I'm only 21 here. :D And low ranking military at that. This XJ project has consumed over half my yearly salary for the last 2.5 years. And thats no exxageration. [/Pity Party][/Violin Music]

[Lincoln]

Lincoln,

[Violin Music][Pity Party] Youre right. However Ive just spent so much damn money already, and am so far beyond my budget for this that luxury parts like highsteer would push me way too far into the red. At this point, its been down for over 3 months and all I want anymore is just to get the fawking thing out of the shop and driving. I may have forgot to mention that this is my daily driver. I have no other means of transpo, and ive been catching rides to get groceries and to work since April.

C'mon, I mean I'm only 21 here. :D And low ranking military at that. This XJ project has consumed over half my yearly salary for the last 2.5 years. And thats no exxageration. [/Pity Party][/Violin Music]

Yeh, I know it isn't cheep. That's why I brought up it was only a few bills more. You've got this much money and time it would be a shame not to pick up this one little detail.

Think about just doing the passenger side. You could pick up rockstompers for $100 or a Sky Manufacturing one piece for $135.

:thumbup:

[ArcticXJ]

Why do that?

Then the TB mount would have to get ripped off, and a whole new one fabbed up, and the TB itself may end up being no good, considering it would have to be re-bent since it would likely hit the oil pan with the arc in it as is. Theres yet more money spent.

You guys are also forgetting to factor in the cost and time of shipping to Alaska. I bought front shafts the other day, and it was over $150 for shipping alone via the CHEAPEST shipping method, ground. There went the steering arm right there.

[BrettM]

Why do that?

Then the TB mount would have to get ripped off, and a whole new one fabbed up, and the TB itself may end up being no good, considering it would have to be re-bent since it would likely hit the oil pan with the arc in it as is. Theres yet more money spent.

You guys are also forgetting to factor in the cost and time of shipping to Alaska. I bought front shafts the other day, and it was over $150 for shipping alone via the CHEAPEST shipping method, ground. There went the steering arm right there.
I just checked USPS 3 day Priority Mail and I can send a 10 pound box from Nor-Cal to Anchorage for $20. Check out the double arms (behind the diff tie-rod) from WFO (http://www.wfoconcepts.com), I could pick them up and ship them to you if you want.

[ArcticXJ]

Whaaa??? 20 bucks? Hmmm.... I gotta go look into this. You have linky? If thats true, then why the hell didnt you say something to me 3 months ago! :D I might actually take you up on this in the coming weeks. Im broke as a joke at the moment though, and am trying to just make do with whats there. Im not going to even have 4 wheel drive when this thing rolls out of the shop, let alone be wheeling it. I still need a new front shaft as the stocker isnt going to cut it, and will bind at the CV after only a couple inches of axle droop. We checked.

I also dont have matching gears yet (14 bolt has 3.55's or 3.73's... i forget) and the odds that the 60 has like ones are slim. No lockers yet either. Im just trying to get this thing back to daily driver status before I can start stockpiling cash for a two gear/setup kits, a rear detroit, and who-knows-what front locker. Matter o' fact, I think Im gonna go start a poll thread on what front locker to use, since I cant come to any conclusions. What do you think?

[BrettM]

Whaaa??? 20 bucks? Hmmm.... I gotta go look into this. You have linky? If thats true, then why the hell didnt you say something to me 3 months ago! :D I might actually take you up on this in the coming weeks. Im broke as a joke at the moment though, and am trying to just make do with whats there. Im not going to even have 4 wheel drive when this thing rolls out of the shop, let alone be wheeling it. I still need a new front shaft as the stocker isnt going to cut it, and will bind at the CV after only a couple inches of axle droop. We checked.

I also dont have matching gears yet (14 bolt has 3.55's or 3.73's... i forget) and the odds that the 60 has like ones are slim. No lockers yet either. Im just trying to get this thing back to daily driver status before I can start stockpiling cash for a two gear/setup kits, a rear detroit, and who-knows-what front locker. Matter o' fact, I think Im gonna go start a poll thread on what front locker to use, since I cant come to any conclusions. What do you think?
I plugged it in at USPS.com, my zip is 95928 and I did a quick search for an Anchorage one and found 99501.

Get an ARB or a Detroit, I'm guessing most of your wheeling up there is slippery rock or mud, so the turning benefits of being able to unlock an ARB is probaly a moot point, so I'm thinking Detroit.

[ArcticXJ]

Good call. As am I, but its such a hard decision seeing as how theyre all so individual in their pros and cons.... and theyre fawking expensive. If I can manage to save up the cash, and the price becomes of little concern, then ideally I'd like to go with an Ox.

[JeepFreak21]

The angles are almost perfect as is. Whether or not the bar has one, or many bends in it has no relevancy.

:doh: Duh! You'd think I'd learned that by now!
Billy

[BIGWOODY]

Matter o' fact, I think Im gonna go start a poll thread on what front locker to use, since I cant come to any conclusions. What do you think?

I run a lockright in my hp60, with 39" krawlers, stroker,chromo's, 35spline outters and drive flanges. I've broken a 35 spline lock out and a chromo 35 spline outer..but the lockright keeps on getting it. The lockright for a 60 is freaking huge, if you don't care about having a selectable locker it's a hell of a good deal.

[flexj]

Looks like some nice work.

I'm working on the same thing right now.

I'd go with a Detriot for the cost alone. They are dang near bulletproof and are about $500

If you need 3.54 gears for the 60 let me know. I'll donate them to your project since you're military. They are used but still good.

Hamy.

[ArcticXJ]

Finished it up.
http://images.snapfish.com/34485%3A%3A323232%7Ffp58%3Dot%3E2344%3D739%3D%3A78 %3DXROQDF%3E2323%3A6%3A5438%3B7ot1lsi

http://images.snapfish.com/34485%3A%3A323232%7Ffp63%3Dot%3E2344%3D739%3D%3A78 %3DXROQDF%3E2323%3A6%3A5438%3B8ot1lsi

http://images.snapfish.com/34485%3A%3A323232%7Ffp58%3Dot%3E2344%3D739%3D%3A78 %3DXROQDF%3E2323%3A6%3A5438%3B%3Aot1lsi

http://images.snapfish.com/34485%3A%3A323232%7Ffp63%3Dot%3E2344%3D739%3D%3A78 %3DXROQDF%3E2323%3A6%3A5438%3C2ot1lsi

a few more to come...

[ArcticXJ]

http://images.snapfish.com/34485%3A%3A323232%7Ffp58%3Dot%3E2344%3D739%3D%3A78 %3DXROQDF%3E2323%3A6%3A5476%3C4ot1lsi

Discs and outboard shockmounts. The "caliper brackets" are those off the front of a 3/4 ton chebby.
http://images.snapfish.com/34485%3A%3A323232%7Ffp64%3Dot%3E2344%3D739%3D%3A78 %3DXROQDF%3E2323%3A6%3A5476%3C5ot1lsi

Desperately in need of suitable tires.
http://images.snapfish.com/34485%3A%3A323232%7Ffp58%3Dot%3E2344%3D739%3D%3A78 %3DXROQDF%3E2323%3A6%3A5476%3C8ot1lsi

[Wil Badger]

looking good man .any plans to do a 4 link in the back to match the front

[Roxtar]

Nice work.
Very nice work.
21 years old, huh?
Too fawkin cool.


I plan to do something like this later, only using Fox air shocks to match up with my rear 4 link setup.

[Jeff 98XJ WI]

Desperately in need of suitable tires.

http://images.snapfish.com/34485%3A%3A323232%7Ffp58%3Dot%3E2344%3D739%3D%3A78 %3DXROQDF%3E2323%3A6%3A5476%3C8ot1lsi

Is the front 60 full width? It doesn't look all that wide. The rear 14 bolt is full width though, right? What coil over shocks did you use and what are the specs on the coils and shock? Jeff

[ArcticXJ]

WillBadger, no plans to 4 link the rear. Ever, as far as I can see. Ive got friends running f&r 4-link setups, and with as much off camber terrain as there is around here, I'd rather keep the stability of the leafs out back. The leafs help for sidehilling and dont load and unload like, say, a grand cherokee. With as tall as this xj is, it would be pretty damn tippy with coils out back. I do however plan to setup a traction bar of sorts for the rear to help with the axle wrap. With the stock 8 1/4" the pinion was whipping up and down more than enough with 4.56's and 35's. I dont want to think about how much that will multiply on 5.38's (if yukon ever fawking releases them) and 39"s. The rolling resistance is much higher now, but the springs havent changed. Another option I am considering is to remove the 1.5" block and have alcan spring make me a psuedo "add a leaf" to fit under the main and run full length, eye to eye. That should help stiffin them up, and hopefully compensate for the 1.5" drop.

Jeff, yes the front 60 is fullwidth. It probably doesnt look very wide due to the modest tires on rims with decent backspacing, coupled with the fender flares. The 14 bolt is also fullwidth, however it is actually about 2" wms-wms shorter than the 60.
The coilovers I used are the Fox 2.0" diameter 14" travel emulsions. 250lb tender spring over 300lb main. Right now theyre setup for 5" uptravel and 9" down. I would say that the rates on the coils are almost perfect, for my liking. Theyre maybe 20% stiffer than the Skyjacker 8" coils they replaced, but that will be compensated for by the exo cage that is undoubtedly going on. Also, I've got an affinity for launching XJ's of motocross tabletops. :) 4-5 feet of air doesnt do a body good when youre running soft coils.

[XJoachim]

Go for 3-link or 4-link rear andcoilovers, i did it on mine after i chopped it (a roll destroyed the body) and i don't regret it a single minute. Just awesome

http://bilder.jeepcherokee.org/d/4697-2/IMG_4495.jpg

I stretched the wheelbase ~ 10" and i'm running 39.5" boggers for now (going to 44s later this year).

BTW, i went with a stiffer second coil for the front (250/400 lbs) and a stiffer valving with the bilstein 14" travel rockcrawler shocks (360/80).

[flexj]

Go for 3-link or 4-link rear andcoilovers, i did it on mine after i chopped it (a roll destroyed the body) and i don't regret it a single minute. Just awesome

http://bilder.jeepcherokee.org/d/4697-2/IMG_4495.jpg

I stretched the wheelbase ~ 10" and i'm running 39.5" boggers for now (going to 44s later this year).

BTW, i went with a stiffer second coil for the front (250/400 lbs) and a stiffer valving with the bilstein 14" travel rockcrawler shocks (360/80).

I'm getting ready to coilover the front of my XJ. I was thinking of using a 130 and a 250 lb spring on Fox 14" co's. From what you guys are saying, this would be way too light? This is a comp rig, east coast, no high speed stuff, winch, exo, etc. What is a good place to start?

[XJoachim]

i run 250/400 and as i told you before it feels great, but i think a picture says more than thousand words :laugh3:

http://bilder.jeepcherokee.org/d/44293-1/meanrocks.jpg

[ArcticXJ]

XJoachim, looks like your setup works pretty nicely. Im still sold on the leaves out back though. Besides, its not as easy as just up and saying "time to drop another grand on coilovers and steel" and diving right in. This project has stretched me quite thin in the wallet.

I originally started off running 250 over 400, and that was deemed waaay to stiff right off the bat. The 300's are even a hair stiff for my liking, but I'm getting used to them. 39.5" boggers were on the agenda initially, but I think Im going to try and keep my CG low as possible, hunker the jeep down low, and go 38.5" SX's. At least I can keep those under the fender flares somewhat. Because..........




For those of you who missed it, this is still (and will remain) a DAILY DRIVER. :D

[ArcticXJ]

Flexj, take mine and the other members' of this board's word for it, that will be an EXTREMELY soft front end setup. Even for slow speed crawling. Not saying it wont work, because it can, however I'd assume that it'd be to your strong advantage to invest in some Fox air bumps or something similar. Dropping off of ledges/logs/walls is going to hammer your bumpstops, and likely your kidneys. That cast iron 4.0 up front isnt the lightest 6 cylinder by any means.

[ArcticXJ]

update....

funny popping, creeking, and cracking noises coming from chassis under hard acceleration, braking, and cornering.

:D Looks like unibody strengthening just bumped up on the priority list, overtaking wheels/tires. Fawking one tons...

[xjj33p3r]

update....

funny popping, creeking, and cracking noises coming from chassis under hard acceleration, braking, and cornering.

:D Looks like unibody strengthening just bumped up on the priority list, overtaking wheels/tires. Fawking one tons...
I was wondering when you were gunna get on that :D

[FlxnXJ]

Looks good the only thing Id question is how steep of an angle your trac-bar is at. Whille you flex you front end is going to move all over the place! The only way to stop this is to have a flat trac-bar, Ya I know no way, but the farther away from flat you get, the more the front end walks around under flexing conditions.

Just something to think about, I didnt know if you would acually hit your bumpstops or not? I 4 linked my front and triangulated the uppers. Also running a HP60, but Iam still coil springs up front, coil-overs are in the rear :D

Iam running a front and rear 60 ( full width ) in my XJ a ( competition rig ) and I have no subframe support other than the stock stuff, no problems here. Been beating on it for 5 years now :dunno:

Cory

[ArcticXJ]

1) Its funny you say the front end will "walk all over the place" cause.... well.... it doesnt. Hmmm. Strange. Guess I got lucky, no? And I wasnt aware that flat track bars were the rage... round ones out of style already? :dunce:

2)I dont have bumpstops. The picures show that. So none to hit, nuthin to worry about! :)

3)You run a "competition rig" of an XJ, with one ton axles, no subframe or supports whatsoever, and have been "beating on it for 5 years" ??? With no problems, huh... I bet the doors all shut wonderfully.

[FlxnXJ]

Iam talking about the angle your trac-bar is at. Think about it when you compress your front end It has to move to the passanger side! your trac-bar is going to push it that way, and the more angle on your trac-bar the farther its going to try to push it over. Same way when it extends it moves to the drivers side. Its very simple, If your front end doesnt move then its welded to your subframe.

You dont have bumpstops, Well thats your choice. Hope it works out for ya

I run a full exo its what holds my XJ together. My whole goal was to remove weight not add it! Sorry cant post pics, but its not hard to find them floating around if you think Iam full of shit, Petersons Offroad mag, Fourwheeler offroad mag, MoRoc, RRock, etc...

[David Taylor]

I run a full exo its what holds my XJ together. My whole goal was to remove weight not add it!

somthing about this just doesn't add up. :dunno:

[FlxnXJ]

Well ya exo = more weight, but I have very little roof, no rear half at all but the floor and no doors or glass, and I chopped 16" off of the rear floor and subframe, get the idea :D I left the rest of the floor because you have to have frame to the center line of the rear axle to run in Legends class.

[Roxtar]

I 4 linked my front and triangulated the uppers.Curious to how you triangulated your uppers. Hard to imagine where they would mount and how they would route.
Are you still running a trackbar?
Also, you say you 4 linked your front.
What was it origionally?

BTW, what exactly does your exo connect to?

[Kaczman]

I can't speak for FlxnXJ, but here's a couple crappy shot on how I ran my triangulated front 4 link.
http://www.xjdb.com/albums/xjs/19_194.jpg
http://www.xjdb.com/albums/xjs/19_s_Frame201.jpg
http://www.xjdb.com/albums/xjs/19_er_Frame_Mounts200.jpg

The pass upper just kisses the oil pan at full compression, but everything else clears.

-Jon

[Wil Badger]

http://www.xjdb.com/albums/xjs/19_194.jpg

from what i see in this picture you are flat on the ground and the upper drivers side arm is about to smack the exhuast.so in other words you have no compression on that side.

[Kaczman]

from what i see in this picture you are flat on the ground and the upper drivers side arm is about to smack the exhuast.so in other words you have no compression on that side.

It's tight, but it clears the exhaust.

http://www.crawltech.com/albums/Four-Link/Axle.sized.jpg
http://www.xjdb.com/albums/xjs/177721521ICBuhF_ph.jpg
http://www.xjdb.com/albums/xjs/177727067PARhYQ_ph.jpg

-Jon

[JeepFreak21]

Sorry cant post pics, but its not hard to find them floating around if you think Iam full of shit, Petersons Offroad mag, Fourwheeler offroad mag, MoRoc, RRock, etc...

I can post the pics for ya if you wanna email them to me.
Billy
http://www.slicky.net/misc/emailaddy.gif

[FlxnXJ]

It not very hard to Triangulate the front end, ( I dont run a track bar ) You can simply leave the UCL axle mounts just to the side of the oil pan ( so they dont hit the pan )and move your subframe side mounts to the out side of the subframe you easily get 40 degrees and luckly for me I had a set of RE drop brackets and only had to make one mount using the outside RE bracket as the other side of the mount. Reason for doing this was to run a doble ended ram for my full hydro steering.
What was I running before the 4 link, a five link. Ya, know 4 control arms and a trac-bar :rolleyes:

I dont even have a way to get pictures to my computer to e-mail
There should be quite a few pictures on Rockport Off-road Parks website
RORP.com I think?

[JeepFreak21]

I dont even have a way to get pictures to my computer to e-mail
There should be quite a few pictures on Rockport Off-road Parks website
RORP.com I think?

This must be it?
http://rorp.com/Events/2005/RROCK/PhotoPage1/images/100_0428_JPG.jpg

http://rorp.com/Events/2005/RROCK/PhotoPage1/images/100_0429_JPG.jpg

http://rorp.com/Events/2005/RROCK/PhotoPage1/images/100_0430_JPG.jpg

Billy

[FlxnXJ]

Thats me

[ArcticXJ]

Iam talking about the angle your trac-bar is at. Think about it when you compress your front end It has to move to the passanger side! your trac-bar is going to push it that way, and the more angle on your trac-bar the farther its going to try to push it over. Same way when it extends it moves to the drivers side. Its very simple, If your front end doesnt move then its welded to your subframe.

You dont have bumpstops, Well thats your choice. Hope it works out for ya

I run a full exo its what holds my XJ together. My whole goal was to remove weight not add it! Sorry cant post pics, but its not hard to find them floating around if you think Iam full of shit, Petersons Offroad mag, Fourwheeler offroad mag, MoRoc, RRock, etc...

First of all, regarding your track-bar speech..
I cant believe your actually telling me this. :wierd: Wow, I didnt know that trackbars moved the axle from side to side at all! Shit somehow in the last 7 or 8 years of studying and researching and designing suspensions I somehow managed to never come across that information...

Secondly, my comment about "no bumpstops, so not to hit, no worries!" was sarcasm. Youre pretty dense, my friend.

And third,

I run a full exo its what holds my XJ together. My whole goal was to remove weight not add it!
Which makes no sense..

Compounded by the fact that you say:
..and I have no subframe support other than the stock stuff
So an exo doesnt count, huh...

Thanks for all your valuable input. :twak:

[FlxnXJ]

Well, I was refering to people who plate their subframes, now thats extra weight that doesnt need to be there, and over time from what Ive seen ( my opinion ) the floor tends to try to pull away from the reinforced framerails.

And, yes my Exo does help with frame issues, because its all welded in, but its reinforcing the rest of the unibody ( roof, a-pilars,etc.. / The exo is tied into the door hinge mounts on the cowl ) more than the frame itself. Since its major tie in's are the front and rear bumpers, and the bumpers allready hold most of the latteral force on the subframe. ( I my case )

Sorry, man I was just woundering about your trac-bar because I had the issue with my bumpstops not lining up, untill I triangulated my uppers and kept the front end from moving around ( side to side ).

Anyway, It looks good, and stop :rattle: about me questioning one thing. If your happy with it, thats all that matters. God knows my opinion shouldnt matter to you. :peace:

[ArcticXJ]

I forgot that I hadnt updated this thread in about the last year... not much to report. I'm just going to copy and paste what I updated from a different board... Here goes:

:)

Picked up my other Detroit, popped it in with the 5.13's, finally have matching gears now as opposed to 3.42's and 3.54's on a set of 33's. I scored a mediocre deal on a set of 38" SX's too. Theyre too small. They measure out to 36.5" at 20 psi. Scored a new shaft from Tom Woods, and upgraded to a 1350 front yoke setup. As it sits now:

http://images1.snapfish.com/34756%3B%3A%3B9%7Ffp33%3B%3Enu%3D3253%3E648%3E987% 3EWSNRCG%3D3233923%3B%3C2337nu0mrj

Sorry for the parking lot... Kinda hard to wheel your junk much when your trying to build it from Korea, while it's sitting in Alaska. I came back on leave with the goal of getting the gears knocked out, and getting it locked and on new shoes. And yes, for you sharp eye'd kids, there's no front driveshaft in that pic above.

By this point, I intended on having an Atlas 5:1, Beadlocks, and a cage built for it.... But the street bug bit me and I instead of finishing the Jeep on time, I ended up dragging this home:

http://images1.snapfish.com/347599%3B54%7Ffp33%3B%3Enu%3D3253%3E648%3E987%3EWS NRCG%3D3233923%3B%3B7875nu0mrj

After getting it cleaned up, and tuned a little (it'd been primarily sitting and/or in storage over the last few years):

http://www.supermotors.net/getfile/404731/fullsize/random-062.jpg

So at the moment, I'm debating which one I'd like to move forward with. I think I'll just see what happens by the time I've put enough extra cash away for the Atlas. If I want it bad enough by that point, I'll get it. If not, I can keep saving and pick up a huffer for the 5.0 sometime soon. We'll see.

In the meantime though, I'll be picking up a few more small parts like diff covers. I mangled the 14 bolt cover just the other day in the little 10x30' rock garden (abandoned landscaping boulders) out in front of the house.

[Goatman]

Awh, finish the Jeep. Once you get it together and get it out to play you'll be glad you did.

:D :D

[oopsbilly]

nice work, wanting to do coilovers myself and this is very helpful. question though. What did you get the d60's out of?? And how wide are your flares??? Building a crawler myself and am in the market for some 60's but would like to remain as close as possible to "legal" width.

[ArcticXJ]

Richard... I know, man. I know. But its so hard when you've never owned a vehicle that had a measureable 0-60 time before. By the time any of mine ever got there, I forgot I was still supposed to be counting.

The Mustang, on the other hand, makes me giggle like a little girl when the rear end kicks out on the 1-2 shift. I'm still very much jaded. :D


OopsBilly--
The front axle is an '88 Ford F350 High Pinion Kingpin Dana 60. If you are planning on coilovers, its a fine choice. However, if you feel that you have the slightest inclination towards keeping your coils, stay away from it. Go with a 78-79 vintage HP60. The newer late 80's models have an EXTREMELY short driver's side tube which gives very very little room to work with and heavily limits your possibilities for coil buckets. IMO, it cant be done properly without purching the driver's side coil practically on top of the diff. If you attempt to center the XJ's coil over the small space between the diff and the C, you'll push the passenger side tube way the hell out beyond the body and end up having to cut that side down heavily. That somewhat defeats the purpose of going to fullwidth axles... know what I mean? The older 60's have the diff offset further towards the center of the rig, and can be centered under the XJ while retaining the ability to put the coil buckets in their proper place, respective to the XJ's factory locations.

The rear isnt a 60. Its a 14 bolt from a 1 ton '79 Chevy. 3/4 Ton front Discs swapped on, and a Detroit with 5.13's. Stock shafts. The 60 up front is 69" WMS to WMS, and the 14 bolt is 67". The difference isnt noticeable to me. Not at 1" per side, anyways.

The Bushwhacker flares are about 6" wide up front, and maybe 4" (if that) out back. The front end of the XJ tapers, hence the wider front flares to compensate. My tires are 12.5" wide on 9.75" wide rims with 4.25" backspacing. You can see for yourself they sit fairly well under the flares, but arent completely covered. I havent received any hassle from Johnny Law for them, and dont feel that I will.

[gatmetalxj]

do you ever wheel this thing!!!! i've been watchin the build since it starte in AK...and i have yet to see any wheelin pics!!!! who needs a front driveshaft....WHEEL IT!!!! WTF!!!! hahaha...just given yah hell....Eric aka akxj (from AK4x4network)..

[ArcticXJ]

do you ever wheel this thing!!!! i've been watchin the build since it starte in AK...and i have yet to see any wheelin pics!!!! who needs a front driveshaft....WHEEL IT!!!! WTF!!!! hahaha...just given yah hell....Eric aka akxj (from AK4x4network)..
No, actually I dont wheel it. Its currently Oregons largest paper weight. But here's a wheeling picture, just because I hate being called out. :D

http://images1.snapfish.com/3483886%3B4%7Ffp63%3Dot%3E2344%3D739%3D%3A78%3DXRO QDF%3E232377795%3C5%3B6ot1lsi

I leave here (Korea) on 10 November, report to some training in Colorado Springs till 7 December, and finally fly over to my folks place to get it. I'll be wheeling it all over Oregon for about 3 weeks while I'm on leave. Well, maybe 2 weeks. The first week will be Jeep prep and family time.


Good to hear from you. Hope your recovery is going smooth.

[Gravesdiggerxj]

sorry to dig this up from the grave... but what's been going on?