housing spreader

[MENEZES]

not really "advanced" fab or engineering but i tried this instead of spending 300 bucks. and it worked great.

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y7/89xj4x4/spreader.jpg

[Lawn Cher']

I'll be the first to say it in this thread...












DOM is better than pipe!

[MENEZES]

to spread the housing as much as was needed. 1" x 8" Galv. steel pipe worked just dandy.

[Lawn Cher']

to spread the housing as much as was needed. 1" x 8" Galv. steel pipe worked just dandy.

I know, it was a joke. Its a recurring theme in cage fabrication discussions.

[MENEZES]

lol. alright.

[Lincoln]

Currious of what axle you were working on that you needed a case spreader? Couldn't have been that 30. The theory that pipe is for poop my fit well in this situation. :D

I haven't ever used a spreader though a 60 has been the largest I have worked on.

Later,
Lincoln

[Root Moose]

Needs triangulation.

Cool idea - filed for the future.

r@m

[xuv-this]

ooohh. aaahh. that looks so redneck-ish. :D great idea!

[MENEZES]

its for the dana 30.

[JnJ]

its for the dana 30.
Why?

[MENEZES]

well, my manual said u need a housing spreader so i built one. the backlash was almost nothin when i first put it back in so to take it out the second time i used the rag method and it worked GREAT, i couldnt believe it. so i ditched the housing spreader and just used a block of wood and a lead hammer to get the carrier back in. backlash this time was 8 thosanths and the pattern was perfect. im happy.

[Lincoln]

well, my manual said u need a housing spreader so i built one. the backlash was almost nothin when i first put it back in so to take it out the second time i used the rag method and it worked GREAT, i couldnt believe it. so i ditched the housing spreader and just used a block of wood and a lead hammer to get the carrier back in. backlash this time was 8 thosanths and the pattern was perfect. im happy.

:thumbup: Your learning.

I would have like to of heard a tighter back lash though. .006" maximum.

[Jes]

My .004 opened up to .011 after several years of abuse.
No wonder no one will buy my used junk.

[MENEZES]

well, backlash for the dana 30 is supposed to be from 6-10, from what i have read. in the middle is good for me, but yea i would like a tighter backlash. If i feel up to it tomorrow, ill tackle it again and try for a tighter .006. And Jes, how did ur backlash increase like that? did the shims just wear down some how? newb question maybe? but im curious.

[Jes]

And Jes, how did ur backlash increase like that? did the shims just wear down some how? newb question maybe? but im curious.

A locker and 3 years of intense rock crawling.
The housing likely spread, permanently.

[MENEZES]

o wow. .007 is quite a bit of movement for a housing. 3 years locked, did it meet your expectations or exceed them. or not even come close lol.

nick

[Lincoln]

Several of us have seen the 30 spread. My dad's stock '95 YJ with very little 4x4 time had opened to .012. The housing seems to stretch and spread a lot.

Actually Jes's sounds really good to me. I'm kinda with Crash, the heavy OX cover has to help.

I've been setting them up around .003 and a hefty preload. Dad just checked his at .006 after about 1.5 years. I really like setting them tight with 4.88's.

[MENEZES]

o wow. .003? thats the backlash i first had but thought it was wayyyy too tight. from what ive heard i better got back and set it up real tight, nothin above .006. i knew the 30 was weak but not that weak...

[Lincoln]

o wow. .003? thats the backlash i first had but thought it was wayyyy too tight. from what ive heard i better got back and set it up real tight, nothin above .006. i knew the 30 was weak but not that weak...

Since it's a front housing I don't worry about it being tight. Just be real easy on it during break in. I like to run it about 25 miles, then cool completely. Depending on how tight I made it I might do that a few times. Then run about 100 miles and check the temp. The tight BL can cause heat to build quickly and overheating a new gear set can cause problems. I check the heat buildup often on break in with just a hand check. I feel for any spots getting "ouch damnit hot".

I set my 44's up at .004 front and back. We'll see how it works in the back. It's not building up excessive heat and I'm running 5.38's.

I would shoot for something around .004-.005.

[Loose_Nuts_Enterprises]

Need to be careful with a spreader, you can spring the case. On a D60, I think it's 20 thou for the maximum spread.

Setting up at 3 thou and getting 6 thou a year and a half later is probably wear from heat expansion. Don't take this as fact, just my opinion.

Isn't going tighter than factory specs kind of like over torquing a bolt? I just don't understand the logic in this.

[Lincoln]

Setting up at 3 thou and getting 6 thou a year and a half later is probably wear from heat expansion. Don't take this as fact, just my opinion.


That could be, but the 30 is the only one I've ever had open up like that. My front 44 opened .001 in 5 years. The rear R&P was trashed so I couldn't tell on it.

For comparison the Toyota rear in the same Jeep with the 30 that opened .003 handn't changed at all.

Regardless that is why I like setting the 30 up really tight (preload and lash).

[Root Moose]

Setting up at 3 thou and getting 6 thou a year and a half later is probably wear from heat expansion. Don't take this as fact, just my opinion.

Isn't going tighter than factory specs kind of like over torquing a bolt? I just don't understand the logic in this.

Interesting.

So what do you guys recommend for a HP D30 (4.56 / ARB) driven by a 242 that will see three or four months of the time engaged in daily driver duty?

Still shoot for the tight end of the factory tolerance setting? Run synth fluid (damn, water crossings just got expensive)?

Why do the Toy axles make less heat? Better gear material? Less housing flex? Magic Nippon juice?

r@m

[bj-666]

if anyone is setting up gears for a daily driven rig set them up on the tight side of stock not tighter ( it causes more heat/friction). also don't go by the fact that it is a front axle and won't see load most of the time except when going slow. you want the front set up perfect 99% of all r&P failures are due to improper setup. you may never see these problems when DDing it but when you hit the trail and play with the skinny pedal too much you could see problems. also i don't see the advantages of seting up the bearings with huge amounts of preload what is that doing except wearing the bearings faster and throwing off the lash?

[Lincoln]

if anyone is setting up gears for a daily driven rig set them up on the tight side of stock not tighter ( it causes more heat/friction). also don't go by the fact that it is a front axle and won't see load most of the time except when going slow. you want the front set up perfect 99% of all r&P failures are due to improper setup.
Correct, but if they don't build excessive heat on breakin they shouldn't being DD on the front. They spin, but on a low load.

also i don't see the advantages of seting up the bearings with huge amounts of preload what is that doing except wearing the bearings faster and throwing off the lash?

I can't see being able to get that much preload without using a spreader (I don't). I really believe the housing stretches and causes the lash to open. I've opened several 30's that were wheeled lightly without a locker and the carrier could be pulled by hand.

[ROCKREADYXJ]

there is a reason spicer put those srpeader holes in all there axles. If you want the correct way to use the case spreader go to the dana web site and download the manual for the axle you are working on. They are there and they are free. I have several copies here for our references. There is a spec for all of there axles. They are very informitive. Oh yeah you will need your BOM# its usually on the tag it you still have that piece of foil. or stamped in the long tube.

I hope that pipe thing is a joke?

[badron]

Most factory spec are very safe. With a lot of play at both ends. I have seen 25+ on DD that lasted for years.
Wear patterns will have/show more to do with long life expectancy then numbers. After you set up your numbers, you should check the wear patterns. A bent or poorly machined housing will give good numbers but show bad alignment and/or wear patterns.
If your regearing, putting in a locker etc. Just have a good look at the old gears set. They should have lots of mile on them. If the bearing were good but the gears look funny (worn high on one side, low the other) you may need a new carrier and/or housing.
Bent housing are one reason some people look down on the 2X4 and hammer way of opening up the housing. Some people just don't know when to quit and end up with a mess.
You hear more about numbers because it easier to pass and check them. It's much harder to explain "looks funny"

[badron]

One more point on running a very tight lash. I believe this idea was pasted down from drag racing. <---(IMO) Many drag car do/can not warm up their differential.
As the parts in the differential warm they grow thereby tightening the lash. Without this warming a drag racer needs to run a very tight lash in respect to stock numbers anyway.
Most offers drive to the trails giving things a chance to warm and grow, or at least don't start by dumping the clutch at 5K+ RPM on dry pavement anyway.
I say. Don't waste you time trying to get a very tight lash for offing it's not going to help.
All this is (IMO). I looked it's not in the Bible

[Rawbrown]

There is a reason why I prefer to folow the specs of the gear manufacture of the gearset that I am installing. the MFG's tend to have great experience in not just rock crawling, but drag racing, circle track, mud bogs and tractor pulls. they must have something figured out don't ya think? when I setup gears, I set them up within the range that is speced by the MFG. obviously in most cases its Yukon or Dana spicer. I will use Yukon for example... D30 is speced for .006-.010" BL. most of the rearends I setup will stop running hot within the first 100 miles. I prefer a tight pattern with a good root to crown center mark and a "just shy of tight" BL with the pattern centered just to the toe of tooth face center.
now lets discuss pre-load. I think some people are missing the concept of preloading a bearing. no matter how tight you seat a bearing race, the bearing itself is still going to have a small bit of flex in it. preloading is meant to dis-allow deflection. by preloading the pinion bearings, you take away the deflection caused by its forces o nthe ring gear. its gonna want to push away from the centerline of the ring gear. if your preload isn't tight enough then you allow that force to push or deflect the pinion, which in turn can affect pinion depth and backlash settings. while on the bench, it might setup with a good pattern. but dynamically it would show you a pattern with a shallow pinion depth and lots of backlash.

I have needed to use a housing spreader on newer TJ front axles on a few occasions. no big deal, just a pain in the ass on the TJ without a lift...