86MJ Info-Dump...

All (most especially Eagle - you probably have one or more of these anyhow...)

There's an 86MJ in the area that I'm looking into - can anyone give me a decent info-dump on what all I expect to find in there? I've not been able to catch the current owner at home, so I'd like to know what to expect, and what current known bugs exist. It's a GM 2.8V6 (yeah, I know...) but that wouldn't last long - I'm thinking either a 3.1 or 3.4 when I get a chance - right now, it would be a working truck.

I'm sure it's 4WD, and I'm reasonably sure it's a manual. Looks like D30/D35 - I'd probably go into shock if I looked under it and found a D44!

It's not a basket case, but it certainly needs some front-end cosmetic work. There aren't a lof of signs of accident damage - just looks like a well-used truck.

Since I haven't been able to catch the owner when it looks like he might be active, I plan on leaving a note on the thing for him to answer at will. I just want to make sure I'm not missing anything that I might want to ask. It's a restoration candidate, but I could use a work truck in the meantime, since it would be fourth on the queue for resto by now (right after my 89 Limited, my 88 Laredo, and my 89 Laredo. The 87 don't count - it's a project, not a resto...)

I don't expect insurance to be too bad, since it would become my fifth insured vehicle, and the fourth in operation. Besides, I'm 33 and married, and I'm doing well in school - which helps.

Mainly, I just want to make sure that I can drop off a complete list of questions (besides the patently obvious "how much?") so I can get everything I need to know beforehand. Seems like this thing has been around for a while, so I might be able to knock him down on it...

Oh - for anyone who is interested - or would like to contribute - I've started my second book. It's a "swappology" manual, which I don't plan on limiting simply to XJ/MJ parts swaps - this is going to be about as generally applicable as my other book.

Any help will be appreciated - I've wanted an MJ for a while, and this would be a good start. Besides, I just hate to see a good little truck going to seed...

5-90

if it's manual, check the driver's side floor for rot.

on the bed, reach upunder the flares and make sure theres still metal there (doubt you'll have issues where you're at, but it doesn't hurt to check)

the bench seat gives more interior room.

you can pretty much bolt up everything XJ except for the seat brackets (floor is different)

make note of the rockers, the lower control arm mounts and how the crossmember mounts to the "frame"

I'm curious if the 86 MJ would need the front crossmember and firewall mods that 84-86 XJs need to swap in a 4.0L. I never had the opportunity to mess with one.

I wouldn't hesitate to drop an amc v8 in there

if its a manual its ax-4 or ax-5, auto will be the tf 909... i think that is the right number. You got it on the axles. Will be any where from 3.55, to 3.73, to 4.10 in the gearing department. If its a manual check the fuse box for fluid damage and prevous fires.......

The heavy rear end in '86 is the AMC 20, but I've only ever seen one (it lives near Eagle's house, coincidently. His place must be the epicenter of MJ activity in the northern hemisphere.) More than likely a D35, though.

'86 was only offered in long bed. The short bed was introduced in 1987. The 4-speed manual tranny was not used with the V6 so if it is a V6 manual it should be an AX-5.

As Lawn Cher' noted, if it has an optional rear axle it'll be an AMC Model 20. You'll know it if it has it -- the diff cover is perfectly round, and the axle is HUGE under there. No Dana 44 in 1986.

CheapXJ said:

if it's manual, check the driver's side floor for rot.

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X 100.....

also, they like to rot from the inside-out above the rear wheelwells, like CheapXJ said. If 4WD, it may possibly be a 207, and a stick-in-can front DS.

Good luck!
Jeff

CheapXJ said:

I'm curious if the 86 MJ would need the front crossmember and firewall mods that 84-86 XJs need to swap in a 4.0L. I never had the opportunity to mess with one.

I wouldn't hesitate to drop an amc v8 in there

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I'm pretty sure it would, since XJ and MJ sheetmetal up front is the same for any given year.

I like the AMC V8 idea, but this being California, the Air Police would never let me get away with it. It would have to be a 3.1 or 3.4 unti l get out of here, and get back to civilisation...

5-90

5-90 said:

I like the AMC V8 idea, but this being California, the Air Police would never let me get away with it. It would have to be a 3.1 or 3.4 unti l get out of here, and get back to civilisation...

5-90

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360's were available in Grand Waggy's through '91 IIRC, so wouldn't that be a legal swap into a '86? Or do I not understand the rules correctly?

Lawn Cher' said:

360's were available in Grand Waggy's through '91 IIRC, so wouldn't that be a legal swap into a '86? Or do I not understand the rules correctly?

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IF they are smart at the emissions place ( unlikely ) they will catch it. Most of their computer equipment asks them which motor is in the rig...and in some instances their computer will decode the vin.

You need to have a buddy OUTSIDE in the emissions area and use his adress.

Sure its not quite honest...but neither is what they do at the emisisons station.

Lawn Cher' said:

360's were available in Grand Waggy's through '91 IIRC, so wouldn't that be a legal swap into a '86? Or do I not understand the rules correctly?

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It's goofy - they don't go by what was generally available, they go by what was available in that vehicle that year.

I seem to be getting sent to "Test Only" a lot lately (that's another pisser-offer I'll save for later!), and I'm pretty sure that people with nothing better to do than look under hoods all day will find something odd, and they won't believe that the MJ "just grew a couple more cylinders..." Therefore, since the MJ only came with the AMC2.46L or the GM2.8L, my options would be limited - but the 3.1 is a decent engine, and I might be able to get away with fuel injection - as long as I can convince them it's still a 2.8 under the hood (which should be easy - the 2.8, 3.1, and 3.4 are all the same, externally.)

Besides, I also kinda like the idea of, say, an Astro-van 4.3L V6 - those aren't bad engines for not being all in a row, and I'd have more room for that than I would for the V8... Might also be an easier swap when dealing with the Smog Nazis!

The new smog machines here (We went to statewide Smog Check II a couple years back) usually does decode the VIN, and tell the guy what he should be seeing.

Frankly, I think the visual check is crap - if it passes the sniffer, that's the goal, right? Who cares HOW I bring emissions down, just so I do it...

5-90

5-90 said:

I like the AMC V8 idea, but this being California, the Air Police would never let me get away with it. It would have to be a 3.1 or 3.4 unti l get out of here, and get back to civilisation...

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What's the problem? The AMC 360 was offered in the Grand Wagoneer through 1992. I though the rule was that a replacement engine could only come from the same year or newer.

Eagle said:

What's the problem? The AMC 360 was offered in the Grand Wagoneer through 1992. I though the rule was that a replacement engine could only come from the same year or newer.

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That's the same impression I had, unless they have gotten stricter in Kalifornia.

They have. It's stupid, I know, but I think it's easier to get a straight answer on anything out of F Troop or the IRS than it is out of CARB.

I got myself "invited" to a workshop they put on out here when they announced the SCII roll-out in, oh, probably '01. Loads of fun - for me.

There were a batch of "Test Only" owners, a bunch of repair shop owners, and me.

The most amazing part was all the time I spent putting them on the spot (probably has something to do with all the "Test Only" shots I've been getting) and watching them be unable to answer simple questions. The closest thing I'd gotten to an answer in some cases was "that's what Federal regulations say."

"Beg to differ - but I've got the regs right here. The Feds don't care - so why is it such a problem here?"

I have to admit, it was a little fun having the Acting State Director and the Regional Director of CARB standing there, unable to say anything intelligent.

The practical upshot is, if you want to do an engine swap, it has to be something that was available in that model from that year or more recently. It's possible to get an exception from a "Referee," but it's easier to wait for the 30-year rolling exemption so you can do whatever you damn well please.

I'm sure I could take that 360, add fuel injection, upgrade the ignition, and do some tuning to make it run a lot cleaner than the 2.8 I pull out, but there's still the problem of the visual test, and convincing the Referee that it's a feasible swap and that emissions will be reduced thereby. Y'ask me, it's probably easier to swim the English Channel now...

5-90

Eagle said:

What's the problem? The AMC 360 was offered in the Grand Wagoneer through 1992. I though the rule was that a replacement engine could only come from the same year or newer.

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I thought the rule was same year and newer. AND the same or lower emissions.

Yah - under Smog Check I.

To think, we all owe this to the City of Los Angeles - festering cesspit.

No offence meant to our LA members, but having spent some time there myself, I barely want to visit anymore - I just go through on my way to San Diego, for instance - or bypass it entirely (I'd sooner go thru Bakersfield!) on my way to Flagstaff...

I haven't looked into what they want for an approval lately, but while you can probably get a "same or newer/lower emission" swap approved, it would be (I'm sure!) a lot easier to do it if it's something that was originally available as OEM.

Damn and blast California! I suppose the source of the confusion is that it was originally a part of Mexico, and now has a name derived from Arabic ("caliphate" - the region ruled over by a caliph. Roughly equivalent to a "barony" in English peerage,) and now they're AFU.

I just wish they would get out of the way and let those of us who are good at something just do it. I resent being told what to do by people who don't know anything useful about mechanics...

5-90

FWIW I'd steer clear of the v-6 and go with a 91-96 2.5L MPI.... Lots of people swap them out of yj's and xj's of those years to put a 4.0L in and it would "look" stock too, and probaly have as much or more power then your 3.1 and a few tweaks would put it in the 3.4 range. Those little MPI 4 popers are great I love mine..... not to mention how cheap you can pick them up for!

Yeah - but I haven't seen one anywhere (this has been the closest thing to an affordable MJ I've seen lately...)

Still, dropping the F/I 3.1 (I can probably get away with the F/I swap under the "newer" thing - I'd have to check) would be a healthy swap - I had a 92 Corsica with that plant, and it jumped. Still not an I6, but I'll take what I can get - those damn 2.8s leak like a sieve.

Once I get out of CA, I can have some real fun with it (like the AMC V8 swap...)

5-90