Cheap (relatively) axles thought?

Ok, I was going to post in Scrappys axle thread, but decided to start my own. I was just thinking of how I could get what I want without doing alot of big money spending and came up with the following thought. There may be problems with what I'm thinking, but here goes:

Desires:

High pinion rear axle
High pinion front axle
Not too heavy
Desire to build it myself
front joints bigger than 760's

Thought:

Purchase a HP60 Ford front axle

Cut the ends off and extend one tube if necessary using a sleeve and weld method.

Use short side semi float 35 spline D60 axle shafts from a van
Width comes out to 63" as I'm told by a friend
These shafts are C-clip though
Can the C-clip portion be cut off and a different pressed on outer bearing and seal be installed to use big bearing Ford ends on the housing?

Fill housing with ARB and 5.38 gears

Rear done

Purchase a HP D44 front end (I have one already)

Cut the ends off and install the D60 ends using whatever means is necessary since the 60 tubes are larger in diameter, right? A sleeve would probably need to be machined to mate the 2.75" tubes on the D44 to the 3"? D60 inner c's.

Have custom shafts made that will fit a 33 spline D44 ARB and use D60 joints as that is the biggest shaft one can fit in the D44 carrier, right? I don't know if these would be more than any other custom length alloy shaft?

Use the 60 outer parts swapping to 35 spline outers when and if needed.

Front end done

Run 38" or 40" Tires on these axles in my MJ.

Thoughts?

The words "cheap" and "custom" never go together. Any really good custom axle
that you put together yourself will be in the 2500-3000 range. No way around it. The good stuff always costs big money.

David Taylor said:

The words "cheap" and "custom" never go together. Any really good custom axle
that you put together yourself will be in the 2500-3000 range. No way around it. The good stuff always costs big money.

Click to expand...

wrong: I did my Hp 44 front with waggy axles, detroit 4:56 gears and custom mounts for about half that.

axle housing and waggy axle shafts new brakes and rotors 225.00
gears, install kit and detroit soft locker all new 625.00
brackets, cutting discs, welding wire, gas, seals, etc 125.00
premium locking hubs 75.00


labor FREE, did all myself from cutting down the axle
housing and rotating the knuckles to fit waggy axles
and making all needed brackets

grand total 1050.00

zuzu dana 44 rear (NON HP) gears locker disc brakes
new mouonts, brake line adapters, mics 975.00

total for both axles 2025.00

If you are willing to shop hard and look for deals and do the work yourself you can save a ton of money!

Right.

You can't use bolt-in bearings on a c-clip axle shaft, that's not possible. You have to change axle shafts and the outers.

Why don't you just purchase another Ford HP 60 for the front and sell the 44, would be no cost difference and the weight difference is not that big. Besides that you get bigger axle tubes and no custom shafts.

xjnation said:

wrong: I did my Hp 44 front with waggy axles, detroit 4:56 gears and custom mounts for about half that.

axle housing and waggy axle shafts new brakes and rotors 225.00
gears, install kit and detroit soft locker all new 625.00
brackets, cutting discs, welding wire, gas, seals, etc 125.00
premium locking hubs 75.00


labor FREE, did all myself from cutting down the axle
housing and rotating the knuckles to fit waggy axles
and making all needed brackets

grand total 1050.00

zuzu dana 44 rear (NON HP) gears locker disc brakes
new mouonts, brake line adapters, mics 975.00

total for both axles 2025.00

If you are willing to shop hard and look for deals and do the work yourself you can save a ton of money!

Click to expand...

Have you looked at what he plans to do with the front 44?

Ummm, I think Dave is talking about the cost to build a front-end that won't break easily.
You'd have to add alloy axle shafts and strong u-joints which costs about $1000.

David Taylor said:

The words "cheap" and "custom" never go together. Any really good custom axle
that you put together yourself will be in the 2500-3000 range. No way around it. The good stuff always costs big money.

Click to expand...

I agree with this and that's why I said "relatively." I can see spending MANY more bucks to get something like what I want. I know there are MANY different options out there, but what I outlined could be built by me...if it would work, and would end up fulfilling all my goals. Jeff

Oh, I could build D44's relatively cheap too (much cheaper than what I outlined for sure,) but I'm looking for something better. Jeff

XJoachim said:

Right.

You can't use bolt-in bearings on a c-clip axle shaft, that's not possible. You have to change axle shafts and the outers.

Why don't you just purchase another Ford HP 60 for the front and sell the 44, would be no cost difference and the weight difference is not that big. Besides that you get bigger axle tubes and no custom shafts.

Click to expand...

Thanks for the inf. on the c-clip shafts. That's too bad. I have a friend that built a rear c-clip 60 from a van by cutting one side tube down and using two short side shafts. Width came out to 63" and I figured I could perhaps use these same shafts in a HP housing. I guess that's not going to work. As for the idea of using a 60 front and 60 rear, they are quite expensive straight from the junk yard and VERY heavy. I thought I could combine ONE HP 60 with the HP 44 and come up with strong HP front and rear axles. Jeff

xjnation said:

wrong: I did my Hp 44 front with waggy axles, detroit 4:56 gears and custom mounts for about half that.

axle housing and waggy axle shafts new brakes and rotors 225.00
gears, install kit and detroit soft locker all new 625.00
brackets, cutting discs, welding wire, gas, seals, etc 125.00
premium locking hubs 75.00


labor FREE, did all myself from cutting down the axle
housing and rotating the knuckles to fit waggy axles
and making all needed brackets

grand total 1050.00

zuzu dana 44 rear (NON HP) gears locker disc brakes
new mouonts, brake line adapters, mics 975.00

total for both axles 2025.00

If you are willing to shop hard and look for deals and do the work yourself you can save a ton of money!

Click to expand...

Cool, LP and stock shafts. Sounds like a huge upgrade. Stock zuzu rear 44
with stock shafts. Is this any better than a stock xj 44?
Where talking about building strong axles here not using junk yard left overs.

Jes said:

Ummm, I think Dave is talking about the cost to build a front-end that won't break easily.
You'd have to add alloy axle shafts and strong u-joints which costs about $1000.

Click to expand...

Don't forget to add 35 spline shafts for the rear.

Good Lawd, we go through enough D-44 parts on 35" tires, I can't begin to imagine running 40's on a D-44.

Found more broken chit last night. :wierd:

CRASH

CRASH said:

Don't forget to add 35 spline shafts for the rear.

Good Lawd, we go through enough D-44 parts on 35" tires, I can't begin to imagine running 40's on a D-44.

Found more broken chit last night. :wierd:

CRASH

Click to expand...

what amazes me is how we complain about breaking stock 44 chit when the fullsize blazer guys run em with 37" to 40" all the time and very little problems....maybe a little less on the skinny peddle? and one other thing to remember you have to leave a weak spot in the easy to repair drive train.....if you build axles to the hilt what is gonna break next? Id much rather replace an axle shaft on the trail rather than other drive train parts

xjnation said:

what amazes me is how we complain about breaking stock 44 chit when the fullsize blazer guys run em with 37" to 40" all the time and very little problems....

Click to expand...

Where does that happen? In fantasy land?

xjnation said:

what amazes me is how we complain about breaking stock 44 chit when the fullsize blazer guys run em with 37" to 40" all the time and very little problems....maybe a little less on the skinny peddle? and one other thing to remember you have to leave a weak spot in the easy to repair drive train.....if you build axles to the hilt what is gonna break next? Id much rather replace an axle shaft on the trail rather than other drive train parts

Click to expand...

Would you consider a hub hard to replace? That's the Dana 44 fuse when you have good alloy shafts and good U-joints.

Fresh Warn hubs are stronger than stock shafts and 760's.

CRASH

Jeff 98XJ WI said:

Purchase a HP60 Ford front axle

Cut the ends off and extend one tube if necessary using a sleeve and weld ... Rear done

Click to expand...

One thing to look into; can you use a stock HP60 in a rear application? My understanding is the aftermarket HP60 centers have different oil passages to allow proper oiling with the ring gear turning the wrong way.

As far as I know, the oiling issue isn't that big of a deal, but I'm no expert. Here is a couple articles showing how the tubes were lengthened by others:

http://www.bc4x4.com/tech/2000/highpiniond60rear/highpiniond60rear.cfm

http://www.bc4x4.com/tech/2001/hpd60front/

http://www.4x4wire.com/jeep/tech/axle/yjrcdana60/

I guess my plan is still perhaps doable if I use aftermarket rear axle shafts...at least for a rear axle. How about the D44 front with D60 outers? Doable? Decent idea? Stupid idea? Jeff

CRASH said:

Would you consider a hub hard to replace? That's the Dana 44 fuse when you have good alloy shafts and good U-joints.

Fresh Warn hubs are stronger than stock shafts and 760's.

CRASH

Click to expand...

true what about the rear.....full floater I would guess...adn how many axles hvae you destroyed with the hubs locked in? usually the damage is caused by a spinning u joint bearing cap, it fails and takes out the axles... full circle clips and soild type u joints worked great in the 454 blazer I used to own in LHC...never broke another shaft.

Jeff 98XJ WI said:

How about the D44 front with D60 outers? Doable? Decent idea? Stupid idea? Jeff

Click to expand...

Very doable, but I would just break down and buy the crane outers. With what your trying to do, I think it would be easier.................:dunno:

Where's Lincoln when you need him? He's deep into the planning of this, though it will likely never happen, as it takes him two weeks to install a hub as it is.

Jeff 98XJ WI said:

As far as I know, the oiling issue isn't that big of a deal, but I'm no expert. Here is a couple articles showing how the tubes were lengthened by others:

http://www.bc4x4.com/tech/2000/highpiniond60rear/highpiniond60rear.cfm

http://www.bc4x4.com/tech/2001/hpd60front/

http://www.4x4wire.com/jeep/tech/axle/yjrcdana60/

I guess my plan is still perhaps doable if I use aftermarket rear axle shafts...at least for a rear axle. How about the D44 front with D60 outers? Doable? Decent idea? Stupid idea? Jeff

Click to expand...

xjnation said:

true what about the rear.....full floater I would guess...adn how many axles hvae you destroyed with the hubs locked in? usually the damage is caused by a spinning u joint bearing cap, it fails and takes out the axles... full circle clips and soild type u joints worked great in the 454 blazer I used to own in LHC...never broke another shaft.

Click to expand...

Well, I guess I'm going to have to modify my "Axles for Rocks" thread now that this new info has come to light.

CRASH

:confused1