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Rubber Windsheild Molding

bzdel2441

NAXJA Forum User
I had a post about a year ago asking if you could use the newer rubber style winsheild trim on an older XJ and everyone said yes and people even gave me pic of their jeeps that they had it done on. Well I have called about ever place in the phone book and no one said they can do it, they said they can only install it to how it came from the factory. Any ideas on what I can tell them to convince them that it would work?

Thanks
Chris
 
bzdel2441 said:
I had a post about a year ago asking if you could use the newer rubber style winsheild trim on an older XJ and everyone said yes and people even gave me pic of their jeeps that they had it done on. Well I have called about ever place in the phone book and no one said they can do it, they said they can only install it to how it came from the factory. Any ideas on what I can tell them to convince them that it would work?

Thanks
Chris

Find a local guy that runs around and installs glass. Most Wrecking yards will know someone that does it for about $50.00. I talked with a local glass shop, they knew what I wanted, and they had NO problem with the swap.
 
When I bought my '88 MJ it had a cracked windshield, which had to be replaced before it would pass inspection. I had a guy come to the house to replace the glass, and while he was putting the metal trim back on I asked him. He said "Gee, it's too bad you asked me now. I could have done it that way if I knew before I started."

Some people say you have to gring off the little studs in the channel that the trim attaches to, other people have said if the glass guy is careful it can be done with the studs in place. It definitely can be done. Find another glass guy.

However, it isn't just replacing the trim. The windshield has to come out, and I'm not sure but I think the actual glass may be different. Maybe that's what he's trying to tell you. To make the switch, you have to remove and replace the windshield. Probably doesn't make sense to do it unless/until you need a windshield.
 
When I replaced my 92 glass with one from a 90, the glass guy said it won't work as they call for different glass.....something about the edges and stuff. I finally talked him into it after we found the size to the be the same....of course he qualified his work as.......well it might not look just right. Afterwards, he said it was a shoe in, no problems. So I guess if they stick to what they read in thier books, they will say it won't work.......once they venture out to the REAL world.......they find it WILL work. It looks just fine by the way!!
 
I have a 88 XJ with a stone bruse on the windshield. It been there for 8 years or more. I was thinking of replacing the windshield to have a smooth window.

I asked the dealer mechanic I use about going to the gasket and getting rid of the trim. Jim advised me against it. He told me the stock installation on the 88 XJ had the glass set in urethane and was stuck to the chassis. The window actually became a "structural panel" of the vehicle.

On the later ones with the gasket the window just fills the hole and is not a structural panel. He also said they have had problems with that design not positively sealed. He told me he had a lot of warranty repairs to get the gasket front window installations to stop leaking.

I still have that window in my 88 XJ and plan one day to change it and install it like it was from the factory.
 
martin said:
I have a 88 XJ with a stone bruse on the windshield. It been there for 8 years or more. I was thinking of replacing the windshield to have a smooth window.

I asked the dealer mechanic I use about going to the gasket and getting rid of the trim. Jim advised me against it. He told me the stock installation on the 88 XJ had the glass set in urethane and was stuck to the chassis. The window actually became a "structural panel" of the vehicle.

On the later ones with the gasket the window just fills the hole and is not a structural panel. He also said they have had problems with that design not positively sealed. He told me he had a lot of warranty repairs to get the gasket front window installations to stop leaking.

I still have that window in my 88 XJ and plan one day to change it and install it like it was from the factory.
It's interesting that the dealer said that. My 92 had the molding talked about here, but when it was replaced, the professional installer put in the newer style rubberized trim.

That style of trim attaches to the edge of the glass, but the method of actually retaining the glass in the body opening was/is unchanged. It still involves bonding the glass to the opening in the body with a special urethane adhesive.

In other words, I don't think the glass attachment method differs at all between those with metal trim and those without, but merely varies in type edge treatment on the glass itself.
 
AZ Jeff said:
That style of trim attaches to the edge of the glass, but the method of actually retaining the glass in the body opening was/is unchanged. It still involves bonding the glass to the opening in the body with a special urethane adhesive.

In other words, I don't think the glass attachment method differs at all between those with metal trim and those without, but merely varies in type edge treatment on the glass itself.
That's what my glass guy said, too.
 
I am just reporting what I was told. I am not glass expert and thought I'd ask the guy who put 64 hours into my XJ to fix the cruise control and got paid for 6 hours.

After that much time he acts like a crew chief of an Army Helicopter who "lets" the Aviator fly it for a mission. I tried LED tail light bulbs for the brake lights and the cruise control stopped working, I went back to normal bulbs and it worked again. The chilton manual even says bad bulbs can cause the cruise control to stop working.

When I am in there again I'll go ask him about the gasket again. I think the gasket would look better with my Pioneer trim of black door handles. I have the shinny aluminum trim on there now.
 
martin said:
I am just reporting what I was told. I am not glass expert and thought I'd ask the guy who put 64 hours into my XJ to fix the cruise control and got paid for 6 hours.

After that much time he acts like a crew chief of an Army Helicopter who "lets" the Aviator fly it for a mission. I tried LED tail light bulbs for the brake lights and the cruise control stopped working, I went back to normal bulbs and it worked again. The chilton manual even says bad bulbs can cause the cruise control to stop working.

When I am in there again I'll go ask him about the gasket again. I think the gasket would look better with my Pioneer trim of black door handles. I have the shinny aluminum trim on there now.

Martin, as AZjeff and others say, that mechanic is full of, umm...well, it ain't urethane. The later windshields are glued in with urethane just like the old ones. The only difference is that instead of snapping in the trim after it's installed, the new ones have the gasket placed over the edge of the glass first. However, the gasket (a misnomer really, because it's really just a plastic trim ring - it neither retains nor seals the glass) does not wrap very far around the back edge of the glass, and the adhesive bead still sticks to the glass, not the gasket. I had a junkyard '95 windshield in my 87 with the later trim salvaged, and when it broke, my daughter bought another windshield and they reused the trim a third time. This was done both times with the original trim attachment posts intact.

However, he is probably right about the leaking. My original installation of the 95 window in the 87 leaked, and my 95 leaks now. Or at least it did until I goobed a huge quantity of sealant into the top of the gasket and covered it with a half mile of duct tape. I have yet to remove the duct tape to see if the sealant succeeded. You definitely need to do it carefully, and because the trim is already on the windshield there's less opportunity to add sealant later if there's a gap or a flaw. The usual way to do a replacement windshield is to cut through the original urethane bead, hoping that you're slicing it more or less midway down the diameter of the bead, and to leave the part that's still on the body in place, adhering the new glass to the old urethane, rather than cleaning it all the way down to the metal. This can work very well, and is apparently considered to be safer and neater than using a pre-formed bead (you can buy this in a roll, like Mortite caulking, but adhesion is iffy) or a huge new bead of liquid urethane (messy, and hard to get the height right), but you must be sure that there is no separation of the old bead caused by rust or prior poor installation. Make sure that's checked very carefully, and fix those spots first, or you'll have water pouring in and wind noise. It's amazing how small a gap can cause a big leak.
 
The guy who comes to my house and does windshields does clean off all the old sealant. But he's a pro -- he carries the sealant in HUGE tubes and applies it with an electric caulking gun that runs at a constant speed, so he can move the nozzle along and get a nice, big, fat, UNIFORM bead to lay the glass onto.

There would be no way to get a bead that neat using a hand-operated caulking gun like what we can buy at Home Depot.
 
Ok...I ran a glass shop for the past 3 years and know first hand that glass from the older XJ models is different from the late models...it is however not enough of a difference to keep you from installing one or the other. Does this mean to just slap whatever in that you can get your hands on? nooooo it's always best to put in what was originally installed by someone that KNOWS what they are doing...

The newer style black rubber molding will work on an early model XJ...but as many of you have discovered there are not many guys out there that either know this or are willing to try it.

Not to hijack this thread but I do however have to discourage anyone trying to use a Junk yard windshield...when it comes to a windshield out of a junk yard it should be considered just that JUNK. There are so many different manufactures of urethane and the necessary prep/primers that not all are compatible...it is possible to use a junk yard windshield and have it fail simply because the adhesives that were initially used are not compatible with the ones being used to install it into your rig. Not only are there issues concerning compatibility but there are issues about damaged glass that appear to be 100% but will either stress crack or be contaminated with who knows what (oil, blood, chemicals, etc that will all affect the windshields adhesion).

Where a number of us wheel without a cage it's imperative that the windshield is installed correctly as it is considered and designed as a crash part...a windshield that is improperly installed will not retain adhesion in a roll over allowing the roof to crush quicker and further than a properly installed windshield which will reinforce the A pillars keeping you from becoming a pancake. Why do you guys think that manufactures stopped using the almighty rubber gasket for Urethane??? ease of istallation? riiiiight, money??? riiiight...gaskets are a piece of cake to use and install and fairly cheap compared to some of the urethanes on the market. Manufactures moved to Urethanes for safety reasons, and the fact that using urethanes allowed them to use larger pieces of glass, and smaller steel supports in the A pillars all while improving crash ratings...oh and don't get me started on you late model owners that have passenger air bags...an improperly installed windshield and you can kiss whoever is in your passanger seat good bye because that air bag is useless...

Also ALWAYS make sure you get a certified installer that KNOWS what they are doing...if the installer is certified he will have a copy of his certification on him at all times...a guy that doesn't is going to ho hum the issue and down play it..if that's your installer you should find a new one...I mean common guys, would you trust your rearend to some guy that's never worked on one before? then why would you trust your safety, your life and whoever else is in the vehicle with an installer that doesn't really know what he's doing...

Sorry again for the hijack...it's just that windshield are one of the most important items on our rigs and one of the least understood or appreciated items....

Matt
 
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