XJ with D60 rear

[ynnhojTJ]

after my 94 XJ is inspected this week i have some major modding to do. currently completely stock Country HO-6, aw4, D30/8.25 open/3.54s.

planning on 4"-5" lift, 33" MTs, chopping fenders.
will lock and regear in the later fall.


for those running with a D60 in the rear of an XJ...

problems or issues with running this large axle in the rear??

hitting tank, too heavy, diff diameter, etc.
whats your opinions?? im sure everyone has their own.:D

[ynnhojTJ]

forgot to mention-- the 33's will be from my TJ, so they are free.
will add BB, 35s after regearing/etc in the fall.

[Grant]

a D60 is overkill for 33's, even for 35's unless you are running a SBC.

You will be giving up almost 3" of ground clearance going from the 8.25 to the 60. Even with 38's the D60 is a mobile plow. Not as bad as a 14 bolt though

If you never plan on going larger than 35's then a D60 is more than you need, a 44 will be fine, and the 8.25 may even suffice if you are not a lover of the skinny pedal.

But if you love "getting it" and can deal with reduced ground clearance, and are getting a deal on the 60 - go for it.

[offroadman83]

got a picture of your jeep Grant-------sounds delicious

[Nay]

Find a 44 for 4" of lift and 33's. Slap in some alloy shafts. If you manage to bust it, think about changing your driving style :).

Nay

[Grant]

offroadman, no pics I can find easily, but the BOTW2 pics should be appearing soon, look for the yellow and black XJ.

[David B]

Dana 44 and the upgraded 33 spline axle shafts/ ARB combo seem a better way to go, especially if you will be regearing anyway. I'm waiting for my Dana 44 to blow up so I can do this upgrade, but I can't seem to manage it.

[mattk]

I'm running a 60 in the rear with 33's and few complaints. The weight is not noticable. It does hang down a bit, but it is it's own skid plate. There is little question that it will be the last rear-end I will ever buy. Screw changing my driving style. I want equipment that will take anything I need to do to it.
mattk

[FatXJ]

You could always shave the 60 to regain some ground clearance and gear it to overcome the extra weight. Just think about the length of the driveshaft that you will have to run with 5" of lift and a very long D60 pinion.

[ynnhojTJ]

Originally posted by FatXJ
You could always shave the 60 to regain some ground clearance and gear it to overcome the extra weight. Just think about the length of the driveshaft that you will have to run with 5" of lift and a very long D60 pinion.

give me some insite to this driveshaft length???

what size lifts are those with a D60 running??
thanks
johnny

[woody]

Howsabout the brakes and lug pattern to match the front axle?

[JeepFreak21]

Originally posted by mattk
I'm running a 60 in the rear with 33's and few complaints. The weight is not noticable. It does hang down a bit, but it is it's own skid plate. There is little question that it will be the last rear-end I will ever buy. Screw changing my driving style. I want equipment that will take anything I need to do to it.
mattk

:eek: Please tell me this isn't a 35 spline D60 going to waste on 33s!!

[Crunch]

ExtremeMopar, I'm preparing to waste a 35 spline 60 on 33s :D . If he is going from stock to 33s, no telling where he will end up. Might as well plan ahead.

Hey Matt, Sean (OneTonXJ) shaved my 60 and the ring gear and it came out real sweet. He also beefed my stock cover with a rock ring. If you are running the big rear with small tires its a great idea, and the bottom is much smoother now so will slide over the rocks much nicer. Are you going to Tellico?

Hey Grant, Yes I've decided to put the 60 in. I don't think he would lose 3" from the 8.25. Unlike the D35 the 8.25 has a low hanging lip that catches lots of rocks and even pulls the cover away from the housing causing diff fluid on the driveway :( ,ask me how I know. The 60 should be in sometime in August and I'd love to get at least a run or two in with you and Carroll(sp?) before Moab.
Catch ya soon,
Crunch

[ynnhojTJ]

stats on my 60:
1.5" shafts
35 spline
trak loc
3.54 gears
61.5 wms to wms
5x4.5 pattern

perfect match for the XJ stock D30. can throw it in when i do the inital lift without regearing/etc. the XJ on 33's is just temporary, and will move right to 35-37's in a few months. the 60 will go in now to cover the plans for down the road. once its in, i wont have to remove it for any reason.
im gonna have to look into shaving the 60. anyone from the MD/DC/VA/PA area done this who may be able to help/direct. i dont want to ruin the 60. i would love to see some pics of the shaved 60s if anyone has any.
thanks

[Crunch]

e-mail Sean at metalbytch@hotmail.com. He is in Ohio but is at Paragon for the weekend I believe. I don't have pics of mine yet but I know he will have pics of his as he has just fabbed up a disc brake conversion on it.
Crunch

[Crunch]

Could be boredom. I just went and measured because I was curious. My shaved D60 from axle centerline to diff bottom is 5 3/8". My 8.25 is 6" giving my D60 5/8" more clearance.
:party:
Crunch

[ynnhojTJ]

AHHH SWEET!!!!:D
any issues with the rear leaking after shaving Crunch??


and i was wondering if you wouldnt mind another measurement???--- what is your ground measured clearance (please advise of your lift/tire combo)??? from the ground to the lowest point of the pumpkin:)

just looking to compare to what i currently have, and even to what the other XJ'ers have who have in an XJ 44 or even a 8.8.

others volenteer to put in their stats with some measurements????? lets see whos dragging....

thanks
johnny

[mattk]

Yes I'm wasted on 33's! But not for long. As soon as I can figure out the geometry for rear coils, it'll be going quickly up to 36s. If I knew someone in FL who could do it and I had even more money to pay them, I'd get a shave. But it's not a big priority now.
And it's not that much of a waste. I'm experiencing a peace of mind few jeepers know.
mattk

[FatXJ]

Originally posted by ynnhojTJ
give me some insite to this driveshaft length???

what size lifts are those with a D60 running??
thanks
johnny

Well I'm not sure if it means anything to you but obviously with a smallish 5" of lift and a D60 the driveshaft is gonna be kind of short. Which for the TJ guys I know can be a hassle do to the DS being the limiting factor in their travel. This is what i have been told but ihave never seen it. As for will it be ok in an XJ? I don't know but it is something to keep in mind. The only D60 I have seen in an XJ was on the front but I have seen a couple F/R D60 TJ's now and they have some stubby driveshafts. I have never seen these two TJ's wheel so they probably aren't concerned with suspension travel.

[Goatman]

Driveline length isn't an issue, it only changes an inch or so. The XJ driveline is still much longer than what it would be in any TJ, YJ, CJ, or many other rigs, regardless of what rear end they're running.

60's are sweet, I love my Tera60, but I wouldn't run one for the rocky trails that I run unless the bottom was shaved, similar to the flat Tera60. A regular D60 really hangs down there, so you need much bigger tires to have the same ground clearance, which means everything else needs to be beefed up to handle the tires.

I ran a D44 for a long time before the Tera60, and I thought the 33 spline axle upgrade would be a good thing......until I broke teeth on the ring gear running 33" tires. :) I blame breaking the ring gear on the 4 to 1 t-case gears, if you run higher gears I think the D44 will live longer, and if you don't run in the rocks.

[flexj]

I really like where this thread is going. I'm doing a 60 on my XJ soon and would like to see some pics of the shaved housing. Is 1tonyj the man to talk to?

[ynnhojTJ]

im seeing not too many people running the 60 rear. those who have can i get some measurements of ground clearance? compared to what lift and tires your running?

and for those running other rears--- D35, D44, 8.25, 8.8, etc what do you have for measurements if you dont mind??? would love to hear compariable lift/tire combos.

thanks

[XJZ]

Just take Crunch's axle center measurements, compare to your axle's center. Just do the math and you'll know exactly where you stand.

You'll never get an exact measurement comparing to someone else's rig. Tire size difference between manufactures, tread wear depth, preferred air pressure, weight of rig, etc., will all add too many variables. You could very easily be over an inch or so off.

[Crunch]

ynnhojTJ, The clearance your diff has nothing to do with what lift you are running. I don't have my D60 in my XJ yet, but I know I will have 5/8" more ground clearance than I have with my 8.25 by measuring from my axle centerline to the bottom of the diff. Measuring ground clearance of each rear only matters if everyone is running the same tire even if the size states the same size (my 33x12.50 X-Terrains are probably not as tall as someones 33x12.50 Swampers).

flexj, OnetonXJ is your guy. You can e-mail him at metalbytch@hotmail.com. You can see some older pics of his 60 at www.siscom.net/~kc8gab/sr/

HTH,
Crunch

[Crunch]

XJZ, You beat me to it by a few minutes (slow typing:( ).

Just for reference, my D60 measures 5 3/8" from axle centerline to diff bottom. Now I expect everyone to measure like I just did.

Crunch

[JeepFreak21]

Originally posted by Crunch
ExtremeMopar, I'm preparing to waste a 35 spline 60 on 33s :D . If he is going from stock to 33s, no telling where he will end up. Might as well plan ahead.


http://www.extrememopar.com/ot/laugh.gif I know, I was just kiddin'. The green headed monster made me say it! ;)

[JeepFreak21]

What's the widths you guys are running with your 60s?

[Goatman]

Mine is stock width, whatever that is. The stock front width is 60.5", not sure if the back is exactly the same.

[ynnhojTJ]

my rear 60 is 61.5" wms-wms.

i realize it isnt gonna be the best indicator, but it would give myself and others an idea of what sort of clearance we'll be getting.
you are absolutely correct in stating that there are many variables here... but lift and trimming would make a difference to the final deciding factor in tire choice. when looking at their tire size and the room available to articulate the meats vs clearance under the diff.
ahhh nevermind...in the end it all works out.

[simonsxj]

How did you get a D60 with 5 on 4.5" wheel Pattern? I need to know, a buddy of mine has a 62" wide D60 but it has disk brakes and is eight lug and a full floater. We are trying to convert a D44 to eight lug but cannot find the parts cheap enough to do it. Or the correct info on how to do it. Just wanted to know incase I might have to convert. Thanks.

[flexj]

Crunch, thanks for the link to 1Ton's pics. Is your 60 shaved that hard or is his extreme?

Could someone tell me what wms is? Sorry to sound stooopid, but I just don't know.

[simonsxj]

Wheel Mounting Surface.

[ynnhojTJ]

my 60 is from a Baracuda...quite rare!!:)
it just so happens to be a great match for the jeep vehicles. i have spent a great deal of time trying to decide weather to place this 60 under my 02' TJ or under my 94' XJ.
with all costs considered, im sure it will go into the XJ.

wms= wheel mounting surface. its how wide the axle is, basically.

simonsxj--- why not just leave it 8 lug??

[XJoachim]

There are some D60 semi floater out there with 30 spline shafts but they are rare and i can't remember where they came out.

Full floater axles are IIRC always 8-lug and the smallest possible with full float axles is 5 x 5.5, impossible to have 5 x 4.5

[Goatman]

The semi-floating D60's are 35 spline with c-clips, and pretty hard to find. They are not considered all that valuable. All of the 35 spline, semi-floating, non c-clip D60's are custom built.

[4ward]

All the housings that I've shaved are exactly the same. I won't do it if someone is afraid to cut down the ring gear. I just don't see the point in doing it, if you're not willing to gain the full potential. Here's a shot of how she looks now.

Sean

http://pics.montypics.com/OneTonXJ/2003-05-22/1053668706_disc6.jpg

[ynnhojTJ]

sean
thats awesome. quite a difference. where are you located???

the 60 i have is 35 spline, 5x4.5 bolt pattern, and is a semi.

johnny

[4ward]

I'm in Dayton, OH- just north of Cincinnati.

All 60 housings are the same unless it's a HP and after the mid 60's ( I believe). Drop me a line if you want to talk about it. I can tell you what to watch out for and give you some tips if you want to do it yourself.

Sean

[Goatman]

Originally posted by ynnhojTJ
sean
thats awesome. quite a difference. where are you located???

the 60 i have is 35 spline, 5x4.5 bolt pattern, and is a semi.

johnny

That's a pretty cool find, too bad there aren't many of those around. Did you say it's out of a Barracuda? I don't think the c-clips matter much with 35 spline axles. I had an eight lug version, but sold it to a friend in CO and ended up getting theTera60. It is very nice to have the flat bottom, it's amazing what it will slide over.

[Jeff 98XJ WI]

How about the new Tera 60 with CRD? That Should slide over things better yet. Bill Van Tuyl seemed to thing the Pro Rock D60 was better than his Tera unit because of the notch for clearance. What's your take Richard?

[BIGWOODY]

Whats wrong with a 9"? I"m running a 31 spline,full width,nodular 3rd member,detriot,514 geared 9" with 38" swampers. Got all sorts of clearence,no shaving,disc are cheap and easy to regear, not to mention can be picked up very cheap. I went the eight lug route for awhile just for the bling factor,but truth be known, my xj has never done better with the 9" ,hp44 combo in it now. Those who have wheeled with me know I will fully get it and at the risk of breaking something this weekend, I have yet to replace anything in the 9". The 44 on the other hand required $800 worth of warn shafts and ctm joints to get it to stay together in the front. If I was going with a 60 again, it would be in front...

[Goatman]

I like the flat bottom better, but I've never run the Pro Rock. I've had plenty who have followed me say they were surprised at what I was able to slide over. You might miss more with the Pro Rock, but I sort of doubt it because most rocks are bigger and you hang up on the lowest point on the diff.

As far as a 9" goes, this thread is about D60's, no one has said anything negative about a 9". I like that a 9" is lighter, and it has good clearance if it's shaved. I wouldn't run a low pinion 9" because the driveline is too exposed to damage for my tastes, especially since I drive mine to and from the trails. The high pinion 9" with the 8.8 is very good, but I've blown a D44 ring and pinion which is 8.5" ring gear, so I wouldn't be happy with a reverse cut 8.8". I want those big D60 gears. For the same reason, I want 35 spline axle shafts.....I want to get home no matter what. SeanP broke Dutchman 31 spline 9" shafts at Johnson Valley last Nov, I'll stick with my 35 spliners. :)

[Willis]

The only 35 spline SF D60 I know of is from J4000 pickups. They are not c-clip though. Are there newer units you are talking about Goatman that are c-clip, I am unaware of them?

My 60 is from a 68 Ford F-100 Heavy Half (5/8 ton). It's 30 spling, semi-floating, and 60" wms to wms. It's also got the Ford small axle bearing ends and 5x5.5 pattern. I am only using the housing for this and replacing the ends with large bearing ford ends. The axles will be Dutchman 35 splines with a spool and 5.13s.

The bottom is shaved 1.25" with out touching the ring gear. I shaved it right below the 2 cover bolts on either side. I also shaved it at an angle to gain more clearance with less modification.

As for 9", you can get 40 spline axles when using a spool. Or 35 with a Detroit or spool, and soon, an ARB.

[Goatman]

Well, I found a semi-floating D60 that was 8 lug. We pulled it apart to see what it had, and it was 35 spline with c-clips. I called around to see what I could learn about them and was told that there are some semi-floating D60's for some applications, and that they are 35 spline and use c-clips, and are rarely used to build axles out of. I already knew that the full float D60's were 30 spline.

That's all I can tell you. I'm not an expert on D60's, in this case I'm just repeating what I found and what I was told.

[STRYKER]

You guys all would swat a fly with a sledgehammer, too.... wouldn't ya? :D

I have the 9" out back, and aside from a high pinion adaptation, I'm relatively happy. I read one of the rags now says Tera is offering reverse spirals of the D60 for rear applications. That seems like a good use for a D60 out back. It'll kinda make up for the strength one loses in a reverse spiral gear that is used in the rear.

Other than that, I honestly think it matches the above description.

John, my shop is still available if you promise not to leave it there for more than a week. ;)

[flexj]

Originally posted by OneTonXJ
All the housings that I've shaved are exactly the same. I won't do it if someone is afraid to cut down the ring gear. I just don't see the point in doing it, if you're not willing to gain the full potential. Here's a shot of how she looks now.

Sean



How much ring gear need to be cut? How much do you charge to do this mod? I was very suprised to hear that D60 30 spline shafts are the same dia. as D44. It doesn't make sense to put a 60 in without upgrading to 35 spline shafts.

Ah yes....wheel mounting surface.....it all makes sense now.

I just checked out the Dutchman website. Their stuff is reasonable. Is the quality good? What about Moser, Strange, etc? Anyone have experience with any of the above?

[JeepFreak21]

Originally posted by flexj
...I was very suprised to hear that D60 30 spline shafts are the same dia. as D44. It doesn't make sense to put a 60 in without upgrading to 35 spline shafts....

Two words my friend: FULL FLOAT http://www.extrememopar.com/ot/naughty.gif

Spare 30 spline shafts are 40 bucks a pair and with the full floater they take 5 mins to replace... I'll try my luck with the 30 spliners ;)

[Goatman]

Originally posted by ExtremeMopar

Spare 30 spline shafts are 40 bucks a pair and with the full floater they take 5 mins to replace... I'll try my luck with the 30 spliners ;)

You must have never broken a shaft on the trail. Sure it's quick to change a good shaft, but you'll need to get the broken, twisted, wedged into the side gears splined stub out before you can put the spare shaft in. As often as we've tried it, with every type of magnet available, I've never seen the broken stub of a shaft come out without pulling the carrier.

[STRYKER]

Originally posted by Goatman
You must have never broken a shaft on the trail. Sure it's quick to change a good shaft, but you'll need to get the broken, twisted, wedged into the side gears splined stub out before you can put the spare shaft in. As often as we've tried it, with every type of magnet available, I've never seen the broken stub of a shaft come out without pulling the carrier.

And it is possible to break a full floater shaft? I thought this enviable process of converting to a full float design was to eliminate half of the stress on the shafts, and let us only have to worry about torque from the engine.....



:confused:

[JeepFreak21]

Originally posted by STRYKER
And it is possible to break a full floater shaft? I thought this enviable process of converting to a full float design was to eliminate half of the stress on the shafts, and let us only have to worry about torque from the engine.....



:confused:

This is true, but it is possible to break a shaft.

[JeepFreak21]

Originally posted by Goatman
You must have never broken a shaft on the trail. Sure it's quick to change a good shaft, but you'll need to get the broken, twisted, wedged into the side gears splined stub out before you can put the spare shaft in. As often as we've tried it, with every type of magnet available, I've never seen the broken stub of a shaft come out without pulling the carrier.

:( Wellllll..... who asked you anyways?!







J/K - you make a good point :o

[Gary E]

Full float is a huge plus for hauling heavy loads but on the trail it helps in some situations not all.

Basically if you have a failure where the shaft shears right at the end where the tire bolts on a full float axle would of helped significantly. This type of failure would be from a shock load, heavy weight dropped down a ledge or a truckload of cement.

However a twisting failure (torque related) a full float does nothing or very little to prevent. Twisted splines or shafts that break inside the housing, like Richard pointed out are torque related.

Full float is nice to have but in a jeeping world they make "precious little diffrence" in the typical torque induced breakage.

I know standard 60 shafts are 30 spline like a dana 44 but are they the same diameter also? I would assume so but am not sure.

[4ward]

I believe full float makes a noticable difference. My key reason being longevity of parts due to non weight related fatigue. Ok, that makes little sense, but you'll figure it out.

There are other good qualities. While I do have to remove the carrier to get that %^&*in' broken stub out, I don't have to risk life and limb by using the venerable wobbly hi-lift to remove the tires and brake systems. I can have my other shaft pulled, diff cover off, and carrier bearing caps off before you even have a tire off. While I'm popping the carrier out and finding the bfh and hunk of steel rod to remove the broken stub, you're putting the tire you just took off under the frame so you can remove 1 side of your brakes. As I'm putting my carrier back in, you are starting to take your other tire off. Do you get where I'm going with this windbag story yet? I never had to move my vehicle, and if I did there is absolutely no worry of my tire even remotely falling off.

The big drawback- 8 lugs, if you can call that a drawback :D

Sean

[JeepFreak21]

Originally posted by Gary E
Full float is a huge plus for hauling heavy loads but on the trail it helps in some situations not all.

Basically if you have a failure where the shaft shears right at the end where the tire bolts on a full float axle would of helped significantly. This type of failure would be from a shock load, heavy weight dropped down a ledge or a truckload of cement.

However a twisting failure (torque related) a full float does nothing or very little to prevent. Twisted splines or shafts that break inside the housing, like Richard pointed out are torque related.

Full float is nice to have but in a jeeping world they make "precious little diffrence" in the typical torque induced breakage.

I know standard 60 shafts are 30 spline like a dana 44 but are they the same diameter also? I would assume so but am not sure.

The shafts are the same diameter. The ring gear is 1.25" larger though and I believe the pinion is quite a bit beefier

[ynnhojTJ]

Originally posted by OneTonXJ

The big drawback- 8 lugs, if you can call that a drawback :D

Sean

oh, come on, is there a draw back to a 60 with 35 spline having only 5 lugs??!??:D

[Gary E]

I believe full float makes a noticable difference. My key reason being longevity of parts due to non weight related fatigue. Ok, that makes little sense, but you'll figure it out.

A semi float axle only sees the weight of the vehicle from the wheel flange (or what ever you want to call what you bolt the wheel too :)) to the axle bearing. So you are saving wear on that portion of the shaft.

There are other good qualities. While I do have to remove the carrier to get that %^&*in' broken stub out, I don't have to risk life and limb by using the venerable wobbly hi-lift to remove the tires and brake systems. I can have my other shaft pulled, diff cover off, and carrier bearing caps off before you even have a tire off. While I'm popping the carrier out and finding the bfh and hunk of steel rod to remove the broken stub, you're putting the tire you just took off under the frame so you can remove 1 side of your brakes. As I'm putting my carrier back in, you are starting to take your other tire off. Do you get where I'm going with this windbag story yet? I never had to move my vehicle, and if I did there is absolutely no worry of my tire even remotely falling off.

true. true I would rather have full float stuff myself, even with the 8 lugs;) People just need to understand how a full float does help. It helps for hauling heavy loads, and like you pointed out can be easier to fix on the trail. It does little or no help to torque related failures.

IMHO for a 1 ton rear axle either get a 14bolt that allready has 35 spline shafts or a 60 with 35spline shafts. otherwise a ford half ton rear (9 or 8.8) has more strength in the most common trail failure, a torque related shaft failure.

yes the 44 pinion can be a weak point. While regearing we compared my 8.8 4.10 pinion to a 60 4.10 pinion and they were really quite similar if anything the 8.8 may of had a slight edge.

[JeepFreak21]

Originally posted by Gary E
IMHO for a 1 ton rear axle either get a 14bolt that allready has 35 spline shafts or a 60 with 35spline shafts.

Are you talking about custom 35 spline shafts for that 14b? cause I'm perty sure all 14b are 30 spline w/ 1.5" shafts.

[Gary E]

My bad you are right Billy, 14b has the 30 splines also but a bigger diameter, whats the diameter on the 60? 1.28ish?

[Goatman]

D60 30 spline shafts (full floater) are 1.31", the same as a D44. D60 35 spline shafts (semi-floater) are 1.5". I agree with Sean that the full floating shafts do have an advantage, even for torque related breakage. On the semi-floater the shafts have two things to do, carry the weight and turn the wheels, and those two things can work against each other in some situations. Most axles break because of being in some kind of bind, something has to give if the tires can't turn. The semi-floating axle will have some sideways force on it as well as rotating force, and this can definitely add to the stress and increase the potential for breakage. The full floater axle only has to turn the wheels, and any sideways force or weight will go against the hub and bearings. I'm not saying it's a huge difference, I have no expertice in determining the actual forces involved, but it does give the full floater the ability to handle more torque than a semi-floating axle of the same size. There's a reason that a semi-floating D60 came with 1.5" axles and a full floater came with 1.31" axles......the engineers knew something about what they were doing.

I also have to agree with Sean about changing a broken axle, he makes a good point about how much easier it is to change a broken full floater than a semi-floater.

[ynnhojTJ]

my 60 shafts is 1.5"

[flexj]

Although I think I know what the response will be, I will throw this question out anyway. I have a front D60 hp and a D44 hp, both out of 78/79 F250's. My XJ has 35's currently and is my DD. I am planning on putting the 44 up front, selling the front 60 and a 60 in the rear. If I go up to 37's, maybe 38's, will the 44 hold up? I don't do alot of heavy wheeling, but when I go, I like to go. Will I regret selling the front 60? I kind of need the cash to finance the 44.

[Goatman]

Originally posted by flexj
Although I think I know what the response will be, I will throw this question out anyway. I have a front D60 hp and a D44 hp, both out of 78/79 F250's. My XJ has 35's currently and is my DD. I am planning on putting the 44 up front, selling the front 60 and a 60 in the rear. If I go up to 37's, maybe 38's, will the 44 hold up? I don't do alot of heavy wheeling, but when I go, I like to go. Will I regret selling the front 60? I kind of need the cash to finance the 44.

Who know's? Anyone have a crystal ball? ;)

All I can do is talk about what I decided, and why, when I was in the same situation. I was changing front and rear axles, and I had a HP D60 for the front and both a semi-floating and a full floating D60 to use for the rear. I decided after a lot of measuring and thinking that the D60 was just too big for what I wanted, and there were too many compromises. It would be very heavy and I wanted to cut it down to the correct size, not run full width, and there was no room for the coil spring perches. Also, because it was a Ford D60, I couldn't put 35 spline stub shafts in it, so I would be running 30 spline Spicer stub shafts.

At this same time CTM came out with their new axle u-joint. I figured I wouldn't break a reverse cut D44 ring and pinion, or locker, and I would have more ground clearance and less weight with the D44. I could run Warn chromoly axles, which may not be as strong as Spicer D60 axles, but had to be damn close, and I would have chromoly rather than Spicer stub axles. The CTM u-joints complete the package. Since I don't have a V8, and I'm not a throttle jocky, I was satisfied that the D44 with those components would be plenty strong for me. So, I sold the HP D60, which along with the money I got for my well built D30/D44, paid for a Tera60 for the rear.

I run 35's, but wheel it hard in the rocks, and I may some day go to 37's (no time soon). The D44 with chromoly axles and u-joints is pretty stout, but if you use Spicer axles and u-joints the D60 is much stronger. A D44 with Spicer axles and U-joints is only marginally stronger than a D30 that uses 297x u-joints, you'll break an axle joint in the D44 about as often as you'd break one in the D30, although you have a much higher probability of breaking an inner axle or stub axle in the D30.

Would you be happy with the D44? More than likely. Would you ever wish that you'd gone ahead and put in the D60 while you had one? Who knows. :)

[mattk]

I think either Currie or Dynatrac makes a conversion kit to stick D60 inner and outer nuckles and u-joints on a D44 housing while maintaining a 5 on 5.5 bolt pattern and using 15" rims. Best of both worlds?
mattk

[Goatman]

$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ :eek: :eek:

Probably not the direction he wants to go.

[flexj]

Those are my thoughts also. I can sell the set ups that I have, along with the 60 and pretty much finance the replacements. Why did you choose Tera60 instead of the FF60 that you had? Obviously less work and better pumpkin design, but was it cost effective? Did you get disc brakes, etc.. with it? I'm hoping that the size of the 60 drums make up for the discs on my 8.8 as I'm not planning on doing a db conversion now. I'm figuring on having about a grand in the rear, narrowed housing, spool, gears, shafts, wheel bearing, brakes, etc. That doesn't include shaving the bottom. I'm trying to see if 1tonxj will work some of his magic for me.

As far as the 44 goes, what is the deal with those Dynatrac 60 shafts? I haven't heard about them. I'm not running 5 on 5.5 or 15" rims so that doesn't matter. I am planning on getting the chromoly shafts anyway, so are they a slightly more expensive option or a way more expensive option?

Goatman, are you running coils in the front? Can you email me pics of your frontend set up? hamyscj@dejazzd.com
Thanks for the info.

[flexj]

Oh yeah, how do you like the CTM's? Are they that much better than the 760's? How are they wearing, etc?

Thanks.

[Goatman]

It's kind of a long story why I did what I did. If I was going to spend the time and money to upgrade both axles, I wanted a serious upgrade. I already had a D30 with Warn chrmo axles and a 5 on 5.5 hub conversion with custom high steer, and a D44 with a Detroit and Dutchman shafts. I wanted high pinion both front and rear, so the original plan was to take the HP center section out of the front D60 and retube it for the rear, and make it 35 spline. Then use the front D60 outers and add them to a HP D44 center section. Unfortunately, Currie and All Pro found that the D60 axles that were turned down and resplined for the D44 carrier took off too much of the case hardening and were breaking, which meant that you could only do that conversion with custom axles (plus, they will only do that conversion using late model F450 unit bearings, not king pin outers, and it's way expensive). I figured if I could get the new 33 spline Detriot that went with Superior's Super 44 kit, and get D60 shafts made 33 splines (instead of the stock 30 splines), with D60 outers, that would make a very cool and stout front axle. But, the 33 spline Detroit was proprietary to Superior for their kit and I couldn't get one (almost had someone who would do it), and I decided that I couldn't get the D60 outers to fit where I wanted them when cut down to 61" wide, and Jack came out with the CTM axle u-joint. So, since I wanted high pinion and 35 splines for the rear D60 anyway, I just sold the front D60 and got the Tera60 for the rear, and built a front HP D44 myself. The Tera60 has Explorer disc breaks, a Detroit, and alloy shafts.

Like I said, I got enough for the axles I was running and the D60 to totally pay for the rear axle. I did all of the work on the front myself, except setting up the gears, and spent about $2000. I ended up with a shaved HP D44, 5.13's, Detroit, Warn shafts, Warn hubs, hy steer arms on GM knuckles, custom steering, and a custom 3 link coil setup. Here's the link to pics of what I did, it also has pics of my D30 steering.

http://fototime.com/inv/3D36952DD1917A1