Extended shackles

I tried a search and didnt find much of anything so sorry if this is a double post to someone else. Anyways, I'm pretty close to settling on a price w/ this guy on this 99xj i've been discussing w/ you guys and i am not going to be able to lift it until i pay off the load...only 3g's so it wont take long..but anyways, my 93 xj right now has a 3" lift...what i'm thinking about doing w/ my new one is a 3" w/ a 1" coil spacer and a 1" extended shackle to get a little extra...my main question is one of my buddies told me the shackles will scrape when i go up hills...true, or not? And what is the major benefit in spending an extra couple hundred bux for an actual 4.5" lift as opposed to an extra 70 bux for the 1" extended shackle and coil spacer? Thanks for any info.

I have extended shackles on my 95, there even with the bottom of the fuel tank. I dont see them draggin before the tank would, if your commin off a rock under the wheel only then yes they might hang up. The extended length puts more load on chassis when side hill or twistin on rocks. Personally I dont like add a leaves, or blocks much bigger than 2".

JeepXJ93 said:

I tried a search and didnt find much of anything so sorry if this is a double post to someone else. Anyways, I'm pretty close to settling on a price w/ this guy on this 99xj i've been discussing w/ you guys and i am not going to be able to lift it until i pay off the load...only 3g's so it wont take long..but anyways, my 93 xj right now has a 3" lift...what i'm thinking about doing w/ my new one is a 3" w/ a 1" coil spacer and a 1" extended shackle to get a little extra...my main question is one of my buddies told me the shackles will scrape when i go up hills...true, or not? And what is the major benefit in spending an extra couple hundred bux for an actual 4.5" lift as opposed to an extra 70 bux for the 1" extended shackle and coil spacer? Thanks for any info.

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There are plenty of parts that will scrape on your jeep aside from the shackles. Scraping ain't so bad, its when you get hung up on something that it becomes a real PITA. Even if your longer shackles do scrape, its pretty unlikely that you will actually get hung up on them. And they are more likely to scrape coming down rather than going up. At any rate, I would not worry about it.

The benefit to a 4.5" lift as opposed to your 3" lift is that its designed to lift 4.5 from the get go. But consider how they reach that 4.5... I am sure you can create something to give you a bit more height pretty easily. I prefer adding leaves to my pack rather than a longer shackle, as the longer shackle will change your pinion angle, and require shimming under the axle to get the angle back to where it should be, whereas extra leaves in your pack will give you the height you need, and not affect the pinion.

As far as this goes :

dyna said:

"The extended length puts more load on chassis when side hill or twistin on rocks".

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I don't think that is true, or at least I can't see how longer shackles "put more load" on anything. Maybe he meant something different, but I don't think its true.

Good Luck,
Buck :canada:

Howcome adding a leaf wont change the pinion anlge??? How about a 1" block under the leaf pack? Or is that basically the same problem as doing an extended shackle? Thanks for the info.

JeepXJ93 said:

Howcome adding a leaf wont change the pinion anlge??? How about a 1" block under the leaf pack? Or is that basically the same problem as doing an extended shackle? Thanks for the info.

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Adding a longer shackle, effectively tilts the entire leaf pack up on the front. If you look at it from the side, you will see that by adding length between the rear eye of the pack and the "frame" will "lower" the rear of the pack. This gives your entire body some lift off of the axle, but it also slightly rotates the entire axle, rotating the differential and pinion upward. This in turn affects the angle of the pinion, since the pinion and transfer case output angle must be the same for the ujoints to turn in phase, putting in a longer shackle will put your joints out of phase, and in many cases, will create instant vibes. It can easily be counteracted by putting an angled shim between the spring pad and leaf spring, but that also may require longer ubolts.....so, if you are changing the ubolts anyway, why not forget the shackle and add another leaf to the pack. Adding another leaf instead of a shackle will also lift your rear end, but will lift it uniformly from front to back, as it does not result in rotation of the axle. A leaf block will also lift your rear end uniformly, but it does stress the leaves of the pack a bit more, and will contribute to axlewrap and wheelhop. The best lift on a leaf sprung application is always to add more leaves, or to increase the arch of the leaves. But, increasing the arch of the leaves will make your ride stiffer, and that is why i suggested adding a stock leaf or two to the packs instead. You will get the lift you want, but will sacrifice less ride. Plus, a longer shackle will only add half the lift of its extended length. So if you put on a shackle that is 3" longer, it will only give you at the most 1.5" of lift. In some ways, this is all six of one, half dozen of the other, but from an engineering standpoint, I believe that adding a leaf to the pack is the best budget lift. (I should clarify that i mean adding another stock leaf to the pack, not an AAL kit, as they are usually quite stiff and provide a harsher ride.) Just my 2 cents....
Buck :canada:

shackles make springs fail faster

AAL makes ride stiff as hell and they (AAL's) colapse rather quickly

Blocks contribute to axle wrap, and give you no more flex.

when you make the jump from 3" to 4" you need a lot of stuff more anyway:
LCA's, possible UCA's, Trackbar, Breaklines, possibility of need for an SYE jumps greatly,

so when you look at all that expense (which a good 4.5" lift should come with) 4" full coils are onlt $40 more than good spacers, and rear leaves, while they will run you a little more cash, are a set it and forget it type deal...

best of luck on whatever you decide...

I agree with everything that XJranger said except this:

XJ_ranger said:

shackles make springs fail faster

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Flatly, its not true, but its a common misconception.
Buck :canada:

So in a nut shell...i should wait a little bit longer and save the extra money to do it the right way and get the actual 4.5" lift....my 3" was from rusty's....is his 4.5" lift as good as the 3"? It says it comes w/ adj. track bar...willl i still need a drop pitman arm for a 4.5" lift? Not quite sure what that stuff is. His kit also comes w/ "brake line extenstions" is that like the low budget way of just replacing the lines w/ longer ones? Thanks for all the input.

My thought on longer shackles comes from watching my spring perches on my CJ5 with longer shackles. To me the longer length adds more leverage to side movement. I agree on a cherokee with the upper mount you`ll never see a problem. But.. on my cj where the perches are mounted, there bolted on with only 2 bolts. It eventually did some damage and had to go to HD mounts.

JeepXJ93 said:

So in a nut shell...i should wait a little bit longer and save the extra money to do it the right way and get the actual 4.5" lift....my 3" was from rusty's....is his 4.5" lift as good as the 3"? It says it comes w/ adj. track bar...willl i still need a drop pitman arm for a 4.5" lift? Not quite sure what that stuff is. His kit also comes w/ "brake line extenstions" is that like the low budget way of just replacing the lines w/ longer ones? Thanks for all the input.

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Personally, I usually advocate for lifting less and cutting fenders more, so I will stand by that. I don't know jack about Rusty's stuff but so I can't comment. Definitely go with an adjustable track bar, and I don't know why you would need a drop pitman arm with only a 4.5" lift, hopefully someone else can explain that one...
Good luck and have fun!
Buck :canada:

dyna said:

My thought on longer shackles comes from watching my spring perches on my CJ5 with longer shackles. To me the longer length adds more leverage to side movement. I agree on a cherokee with the upper mount you`ll never see a problem. But.. on my cj where the perches are mounted, there bolted on with only 2 bolts. It eventually did some damage and had to go to HD mounts.

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Are your perches really bolted to the axle? I don't think i've seen that before. Could you explain the part about "leverage to side movement"? I don't understand that either, but i would like to...
Buck :canada:

in my recent post, i learned a lot about the DPA (drop pitman arm) and its uselessness in a cherokee:

http://www.naxja.org/forum/showthread.php?t=35872

search for rusty's and see what others have said about him... and his products... call him and talk to him...
(the general opinion of rustys, it that it is a low budget lift, built on low budget parts)

Most everyone runs the Rubicon Express lift setups...

i would definitely go the save up a little more and buy the right kit for what you want...
wheeling stock is fun too... (i loved it for a year)

the search button is your friend

I have a 92 4 dr w/a 3" Rough Country lift in it. The long AAL is installed, used about 5 months and it's sagging already. I picked up unused Daystar shackles and used 2" blocks. I'm wondering which to use.
I like to carry tools, my wife and little girl and a spare 31" tire. I haven't had any new vibes since the lift was installed.
The blocks are angled and marked front/top to tilt the pinion up.
Brakeline extensions might be needed, right?
I may ditch this set up for superlift springs in a few months.