Rusty's NEW Steering Conversion

[xxxj-va]

Is it me, or are the pics on his site missing a trac bar and anti-sway bar? That a function of the long arm kit? School me.

P

[woody]

Looks like the TB isn't installed yet (the brace is there, no TB)

Unless I've been asleep in class, ya need a TB with long-arms too

[thompson97]

i just talked to rusty about it (i'm currently looking for a new steering set up), and he said he left it out of the picture purely for visibilty reasons. he didn't want the orange trackbar to blend with the orange drag arm or frame strengthener.

BTW.. has anyone had any experience with that steering conversion? i'm racking my brain on this, and i need to buy one this week.:banghead:

[thompson97]

oh yeah, he said its not new. he just hadn't gotten around to posting pictures of it yet.

[Slip Kid]

Ok what pic are you guys looking at? I can't seem to find any closups of that on his site. Acually I can't find any pictures with anything orange in front of the axle... am I just colorblind?

[thompson97]

the pics are on the home page with his updates, labeled 1,2,3,4,5, etc.

[RCP Phx]

It actually looks pretty scary.By stacking the heims it creates alot of leverage!

[CheapXJ]

All those heims should be run in double shear, and those aren't very big misalignment washers either...

I'm not very impressed at all. Better off reaming the knuckles for chevy TREs and makin an inverted T outta that :eek:

[steveVA]

it seems very stout.. and not priced too bad..

[xj4rocks]

Originally posted by CheapXJ
All those heims should be run in double shear, and those aren't very big misalignment washers either...



ditto on the double shear. that's a lot of shear load on that bolt. would suck to loose the draglink/tierod off the right wheel all at once. :eek: and heims aren't legal for those of us that still have state safety inspections. (at least they aren't here in PA)

Also....no sway bar tabs?

[simonsxj]

I have run this system before. Usualy I would run the cross tube beneath the knuckles and the tie rod above, less leverage. But I have run the system above and had no problems or any loosening of the bolts at all. If you are worried about hitting the steering components, drive slower and watch where you are going, I have never bent a steering component in ten years of off-roading.

[FJH97XJ]

I agree w/ simonsxj. If you run the tierod below & the drag link above the leverage isnt so bad. I've been running it that way for sometime untill I changed front axle & used CJ outer's.

[ashmanjeepxj]

Originally posted by simonsxj
I have run this system before. Usualy I would run the cross tube beneath the knuckles and the tie rod above, less leverage. But I have run the system above and had no problems or any loosening of the bolts at all. If you are worried about hitting the steering components, drive slower and watch where you are going, I have never bent a steering component in ten years of off-roading.

Thats what Avalanche reccomended on my axle but I feal alot safer using tierod ends..

The 2026R and 2027L 1ton tierod ends are 7/8-18 not 3/4 like the heims are and these rod ends ahve more miss alignmetn then heims do with miss alignment spacers.

I dont know if you coudl fit the 2026s on a d30 though.. There a big taper so somethign liek .6in to .7in taper..

eventually the tierod hole in your steering knuckle will be so big your knuckle will just crack...

Id like to see the new rusty steering stuff...

[simonsxj]

I run high quality $80 each heims which are only 5/8" with1/4" wall tube and high misalignment shims, I can get 45 degrees of misalignment, I also run the little dirt boots. the boots make them last a lot longer and are very cheap. I also run high grade aircraft quality bolts. Also the knuckle with the 5/8 hole is much stronger. As I said I have had no problems at all.

[ashmanjeepxj]

Originally posted by simonsxj
I run high quality $80 each heims which are only 5/8" with1/4" wall tube and high misalignment shims, I can get 45 degrees of misalignment, I also run the little dirt boots. the boots make them last a lot longer and are very cheap. I also run high grade aircraft quality bolts. Also the knuckle with the 5/8 hole is much stronger. As I said I have had no problems at all.

Thats alot of missalignment!

but thats a healthy cost too!!:eek:

so its a 5/8in hole .625in and what size is the threaded end going to the tierod? (5/8in also). For the d30 like you said the smaller hole is beter...

What brand heims are those? are they greasable? those boots sound helpfull but havent seen them yet.

sounds good..

[thompson97]

what do you guys thinks of these bulletproof steering conversions?

http://performanceunlimited.com/steering/steeringsystems.html
http://performanceunlimited.com/steering/steeringoption.html

[ashmanjeepxj]

Originally Performance Unlimited
OEM tie rod ends also have inadequate sealing surfaces, which require constant maintenance and grease, and do not live very long in harsh environments or in dusty, dirty, muddy or watery conditions. Their "seals" are only good for what they state they are, "dust seals". Their seals allow water, sand and debris to enter the greased surface, but the debris is then immediately trapped and does not leave unless an immediate re-greasing pushes it out as soon as the contamination occurs.

Competition vehicles don't use OEM tie rod ends for any type of performance applications because they are not strong enough or reliable enough for those demanding types of applications. However, many other "heim" joint manufacturers know their product is primarily used by "econo" racers that view those pieces as "disposable", therefore the cheapest brands sell the best, which further fuels the manufacturers to provide a "fair" rod end, but at the cheapest price possible. Our Bullet Proof Spherical Rod Ends™ are designed with the utmost quality, maximum performance and longest service life in mind and manufactured with the absolute best materials and with the highest tolerances possible, without cost or profit being a limiting factor. That's why our rod ends are so superior to any other off-the-shelf rod end on the market.
[/url]

Those are some bold statements....

It is ture that comp vechiles dont use tierod ends, but I say more for the "disposable" view on spherical bearings.

One problem for spherical bearings is the bolt hole...
That bolt hole requires precision, if the hole is slightly too large, your knuckle is distroyed, and your steering will always have slop. You could weld and re drill:confused:

The bolt thoguh grage 9 could also slightly deform under load and cuase slop in the knuckle. thats an easy fix, just buy a new bolt, but with a tie rod end, all you need to do is re-tightenit.

[simonsxj]

ashmanjeepxj
The bolt thoguh grage 9 could also slightly deform under load and cuase slop in the knuckle. thats an easy fix, just buy a new bolt, but with a tie rod end, all you need to do is re-tightenit.

Have you any idea of the tensile and torsional strength of a grade 9 bolt? You will break the knuckle before you deform that bolt. Also the bolt I use is made by ARP and has a tensile strength of 180.000 psi and a torsional strength of 60,000 pounds. Think a steering box can put that much power out??? Also a tie rod is a lot weaker than any heim joint as it is manufactured in bulk and as such has much weaker tolerances, and is made out of much weaker materials. Thats why I sank alot money into them, to get quality and strength. Cheap parts create cheap systems. Lot of good info at chassisshop.com. I used to use cheap parts until I had one fail, now I build them to never fail. I can build you one if you want . I use Aurora Heim joints model #HXAB-8t have a look they work.

[ashmanjeepxj]

Originally posted by simonsxj
Also the bolt I use is made by ARP and has a tensile strength of 180.000 psi and a torsional strength of 60,000 pounds. Also a tie rod is a lot weaker than any heim joint as it is manufactured in bulk and as such has much weaker tolerances, and is made out of much weaker materials.

Like you said there is more documentation for the quality of the spherical bearings where as the tierod ends are mass produced and we dont know the materials or a rated strength.

I dont need as set but thanks, I just bought a whole set of tierod ends for my project. maby next project ill give the spherical bearings a chance.

[SV1CEC]

Originally posted by thompson97
what do you guys thinks of these bulletproof steering conversions?

http://performanceunlimited.com/steering/steeringsystems.html
http://performanceunlimited.com/steering/steeringoption.html

Is anyone using these conversions?

I will soon need to order a new steering setup and these look very good. My only worries for an over-the-knuckle setup, is iif it will clear all the other pieces on the exle, like sway bar mounts etc.

Any ideas?

Tnx and rgds

[Lucas]

Ive seen workable homebrew stuff that was much scrawnier than that

[xj4rocks]

Originally posted by SV1CEC
Is anyone using these conversions?

I will soon need to order a new steering setup and these look very good. My only worries for an over-the-knuckle setup, is iif it will clear all the other pieces on the exle, like sway bar mounts etc.

Any ideas?

Tnx and rgds

It probably won't when you put the Tierod over the knuckle it's almost guaranteed to get into the sway bar tab, and maybe even the steering stablizer/tracbar mount.

[ashmanjeepxj]

Originally posted by SV1CEC
Is anyone using these conversions?

I will soon need to order a new steering setup and these look very good. My only worries for an over-the-knuckle setup, is iif it will clear all the other pieces on the exle, like sway bar mounts etc.

Any ideas?

Tnx and rgds

DUH.. the sway bar extension are History...

you coudl weld a piece of 1/2in thick 1in wide plate to the top of your top knuckle ear then make you sway bar disconnects shorter. if ther shorter they will be stronger...

then you will need to raise your track bar axle end mount to matcht the hieght of the drag link so the drag linka nd track bar ar parell.

Also with the tierod over the knuckel and using a Rubiconexpress or Rustys Frame end track bar bracket you will need to shift yoru axle forward like 1in to clear the bracket.

The teara knuckle kit I think is the best steering solution available.. check it out...

Here is a pic of rocksurfs steering... The track bar mount is custom.
Thats Tera's new knuckel for a high drag link. you coudl run your tierod comming in from the top...

[SV1CEC]

Ashman and XJ4rocks,

Thanks for taking the time to answer, sincerely appreciated.

However, I think that I should give up with the over-the-knuckle type. This requires a lot of fabrication, and in this country, there aren't too many shops I could trust to do this kind of "operation" on my axle and steering.

As a side note, my dreadfull steering problems seem to be cured. Believe it or not, the reason was the TRE at the end of Rusty's trackbar. Last Friday, I replaced that with the bushing end and the appropriate mount, and did an alignment job as well. The truck now feels very solid and the steering is much more precise. There is a barely noticeable tendency to wander, which might be due to one of the ball joints, I'll have to replace that one I guess. And my caster is only 6 degrees (I wanted to make sure it didn't create any problems with my pinion angle), so I think the steering will be more improved, if I take that to 7.

As for a steering improvement, I am leaning towards Zion Dunn's solution (you may check it out at http://www.xjworld.4wdriver.com/
, I think it can be made at a very reasonable cost (Zion is willing to make one for me, I do not have access to any fabrication equipment, nor to such parts) and it is a bolt-on replacement of the original setup.

Again, many thanks and kind regards