so what happened? any opinions?

[WHEEL'er-DLR]

this week-end i hooked up the xj to the motor home to tow to Calico...this is where the problem occured. the xj is to able to be flat towed by putting the transfer case in neutral and the tranny in park ..and off you go. well, i went to the right then right again then left...but the xj did not go left!!! the left front wheel would not follow.....specs: ft dana 30 with det. locker and 4.56 gears and a posi-lok. the rear is a dana 44 w/det. the tranny is auto....'so what happened? any opinions? :dunno: ended up using a dolly and disc. the drive line...what a pain!

[JeepFreak21]

Whichever t-case you have, 231 or 242, you can flat tow it just like you said you did... so I'm going to have to confirm what you thought in the first place which is that the problem lied deeper.
Billy


BTW - was your steering wheel unlocked? ie. key turned to accessory?

[WHEEL'er-DLR]

yes...the steering was unlocked. on a real mild turn it followed...but on a left turn, the wheel would go the oposite direction. the toe-in was correct and also the alignment was ok. still confused... :dunno:

[Kejtar]

yes...the steering was unlocked. on a real mild turn it followed...but on a left turn, the wheel would go the oposite direction. the toe-in was correct and also the alignment was ok. still confused... :dunno:

Could it be possibly related to the locked front end?

[WI88XJ]

Wheeler,

I ran into the same problem trying to flat tow my '88 w/my brothers motorhome. If you look at the back of your mhome, notice how much 'ass-end' hangs past the rear axle (which is the pivot point). His is like 5 or 6 feet. Now visualize when you make a sharp left (or right) turn. While you are turning left sharply, the ass-end is swinging to the right which is dragging the front of your XJ to the right! This is why on mild turns it doesn't do this, just on the really sharp ones. The only way to solve this is to do what you (and I) ended up doing. Using a tow dolly.

Oh, by the way, you don't have to disconnect the DS when using a tow dolly. Just make sure you strap the front end to the dolly tightly and then run the transfercase/tranny just like you would flat towing it. No hassles.
Steve

[TRNDRVR]

Lockers!!!
I think Casper had this same problem last year just before Moab.
Dan.

[JeepFreak21]

Wheeler,

I ran into the same problem trying to flat tow my '88 w/my brothers motorhome. If you look at the back of your mhome, notice how much 'ass-end' hangs past the rear axle (which is the pivot point). His is like 5 or 6 feet. Now visualize when you make a sharp left (or right) turn. While you are turning left sharply, the ass-end is swinging to the right which is dragging the front of your XJ to the right! This is why on mild turns it doesn't do this, just on the really sharp ones. The only way to solve this is to do what you (and I) ended up doing. Using a tow dolly.

Steve


You're right, it is bound to do that because the motorhome extends a certain amount passed the rear wheels (pivot point), but once you straighten out (in the motorhome) and the lrear goes the opposite way, the jeep should follow and straighten out.
Billy

[WI88XJ]

Lockers!!!
I think Casper had this same problem last year just before Moab.
Dan.

Dan,

My front axle is open, just locked in the rear. When I've flat towed it behind my wifes '00 it didn't do that. Only with the big motor home.

Steve

[WI88XJ]

You're right, it is bound to do that because the motorhome extends a certain amount passed the rear wheels (pivot point), but once you straighten out (in the motorhome) and the lrear goes the opposite way, the jeep should follow and straighten out.
Billy


You would think so, Billy, but mine didn't. It would keep trying to drag it with the wheels kinked to one side or the other. Can't explain why it was like that.

[JeepFreak21]

You would think so, Billy, but mine didn't. It would keep trying to drag it with the wheels kinked to one side or the other. Can't explain why it was like that.


Are you locked up front too?

[WI88XJ]

Are you locked up front too?

Not yet

[Rev Den]

Perhaps in a sharp turn the rear off the motorhome is moving far enough, in a small enoguh radius to require the front of the Jeep to turn all the way to the locks to keep up. Theroy being that the Jeep steering is then unable to readjust back to straight on its own. I am thinking readjusting the steering stops to a less severe angle may be the answer.

or...

just trailer it.


Rev

[TRNDRVR]

Some info regarding this exact same thing here in this thread. (http://www.naxja.org/forum/showthread.php?t=11552)

[WI88XJ]

Perhaps in a sharp turn the rear off the motorhome is moving far enough, in a small enoguh radius to require the front of the Jeep to turn all the way to the locks to keep up. Theroy being that the Jeep steering is then unable to readjust back to straight on its own. I am thinking readjusting the steering stops to a less severe angle may be the answer.

or...

just trailer it.


Rev

I feel you have the correct theroy, Rev Den. I would rather just dolly it then change the stops just to flat tow it. That would ruin the turning radius for everyday driving. Trailering it would be the perfect fix so long as the weight isn't a problem for the tow vehicle.

Steve

[WI88XJ]

Some info regarding this exact same thing here in this thread. (http://www.naxja.org/forum/showthread.php?t=11552)

Good link TRNDRVR. Who knows :dunno: Maybe it's a 'little from line A and a little from line B'.

[WHEEL'er-DLR]

good feed back about the turning radius...i do have ft and rear lockers...goatman reccomends a 2low kit w/a true nuetral...to free up the drive lines..i agree with that solution..but the turning radius is still a thought. what if i extended the tow bar lenght...do i need to this?? i'd rather not, by the way the overhang is 8 feet. {in this idea] why would it turn right..ok.?

[WI88XJ]

good feed back about the turning radius...i do have ft and rear lockers...goatman reccomends a 2low kit w/a true nuetral...to free up the drive lines..i agree with that solution..but the turning radius is still a thought. what if i extended the tow bar lenght...do i need to this?? i'd rather not, by the way the overhang is 8 feet. {in this idea] why would it turn right..ok.?

I doubt extending the tow bar length would be a good fix. You would have to add a large length to change the way your Jeep would track behind your motorhome. I wouldn't trust the strength integraty of the longer tube. As far as why it seems to return to center for you when you're turning right is a mystery to me. In therory, it should have the same problem. I wish I could give you a better answer. Someone w/more smarts then me should chime in. I just base my opinion on a couple of decades of pulling singles and double trailers.
If you plan on towing with the motorhome on a fairly regular basis, I feel a tow dolly would be a good investment. You're adding two more pivot points to the equation without compramising the tongue weight or the strength of the tow bar.

Sure sounds good on paper, doesn't it! ;)

Steve

[red87cherokee]

Oh, by the way, you don't have to disconnect the DS when using a tow dolly. Maybe this isn't correct information.

Based on the fact that Wheeler has a D44, I'm assuming that his is an early model XJ (of course he could have put the D44 into a newer rig) . . . as in '87-89. If this is the case, the NP231 doesn't have a true neutral - when the tcase is shifted to neutral, both axles are still linked solidly to the tcase (even though the tcase is disconnected from the tranny). On older 231's (I'm not sure when the change happened) you cannot dolly tow without disconnecting one of the driveshafts, on newer 231's the tcase has a true neutral and the two axles are disconnected when the tcase is in N.

[WHEEL'er-DLR]

mine is a '91 xj w/ H.O. 4.0 and auto tranny. i put the dana 44 in plus added 4.56 gears and detroit lockers ft and rear. i run 33 x12.5 gy mtr's w/ 5 inches of lift. i also replaced the dana 30 vacume with a posi-lok cable. does the 231 for '91 have a true nuetral?? if not...will this fix this situation... :search:

[rockin'_phil]

hey jaybird-this is by far the most nerve-racking problem i've ever seen. sounds good to tow yer rig behind the motorhome. but who ever knew we would run into all that mess at the lot. my guess is as good as yours-i think it has something to do with the t-case or the lockers. even using a dolly sounds ok but if disconnecting the d-line is gonna be a routine everytime you want to take it somewhere then i wouoldn't deal with the hassle. there's a solution to this, there has to be, one way or another we'll figure it out. let my dad know if you need any help
phillip

[Goatman]

What's happening, Phillip. I guess you and your Dad made it home in one piece.

I don't think this problem is a big mystery. When the t-case is put in neutral the front and rear are locked together. Basically the t-case unhooks from the trans but puts itself into 4wd mode. This isn't a problem without lockers, but with lockers it is a big problem. The front disconnect will un-couple the right side axle, but the drivers side axle is still hooked to the rear axle, which could easily cause some torque which could affect the steering. The test to isolate the problem would be to disconnect both drivelines and see if the problem goes away. My opinion is that installing a Tera 2Low conversion that also provides a true neutral in the t-case will solve the problem.

We'll see.....

[Christopher]

Throw it on a flatbed and call it good. Much simpler, not to mention you'll save some miles on the tires, axles, & ujoints.