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Synthetic Winch Line?

ARTSTER

NAXJA Forum User
Looking to save some weight on the front end.What are the drawbacks if any? How much weight would a synthetic line save? Lastly, is this a worthy upgrade for the money? I wheel often and the winch comes out often (friends and what not).

Thanx Art :)
 
I don't have any experience with the synthetic stuff, heck, I don't even have a winch. However I've read quite a few EXCELLENT threads in the Gen 4x4 section of www.pirate4x4.com You might try a search over there for some great hands on info. :)

Ary
 
we haven't had this debate for some time, near as i can remember...

lets go!

sooooo many good qualities about running non-steel rope.....

so few negatives....

I went the sythetic route after tearing up a steel rope in moab saving one tons ass the whole time.....

man, woulda been nice to do a 10-minute splice job on a syth rope.....

good think phat xj was there to save the day.
 
Beezil, have you run into the synthetic rope fraying to much or just plain getting cut? My only worry is that it will cut on that 1 rock that the rope will have to rub on to get up and over to the next obstacle.

Thanx Art
 
So what are the actual weight savings of going synthetic? A hundred pounds or so pounds? My biggest concern is safety of wire rope snapping and wiping someone out, and the splicing capability.

I'm anxious to hear how it works in the rocks however.
 
A hundred lbs. savings? Uh, my entire XD9000i assembly doesn't weigh that much.

I don't like the fraying potential I see with synthetic line. I know my steel line picks up a fair amount of crud in use, and running a synthetic line over rocks and any thing else on the ground is an invitation for a cut.
 
Yeah, see, I don't have any idea on the weight savings. If I was to see the benefit, I would think it would only be the safety factor, the strength is pretty comparable I believe, but then, what do I know. :)
 
You'll probably cut about 25lbs between your steel cable & cast hawse fairlead, if you're running a roller fairlead you'll cut even more weight.
I've seen synth line break about 5 times, I've never seen a steel cable break. But, when synth line breaks it's not going to kill anyone, & you can tie it back together & you're good to go, or for about $20 you can resplice it & it's good as new.
Paul
 
Paul S said:
I've seen synth line break about 5 times, I've never seen a steel cable break. But, when synth line breaks it's not going to kill anyone, Paul

Unless you're winching up a real steep hill with a 400ft drop at the bottom of it when it breaks. Oh ya your brakes don't work either. :D

hinkley
 
artster, I haven't a clue....

I just wanted to get a good debate going....

I've only used my syth rope a few times....

I've used my "stock" steel rope a bunch, although it didn't survive well being strung across slickrock too long....

I thought that was one of those good points about steel, that it could take more abuse....I thought differently that day on pritchett, when my line frayed to the point of being dangerous to use again...

I have no idea which is better.

I'm sure both are good for certain reasons....

its probably one of those "YMMV" things....
 
I like mine. You have to be more careful about dragging it over rocks and stuff. Some guys carry a 4' piece of carpet or something to act as as guard. I've only used it 2 times so far, but I like it.
 
You guys that have seen the synth line break, has it been in situations where an abrasion guard was used? was not used, but if it had, would have made a difference? abrasion guard wouldn't have done a damn thing regardless?

Ary
 
I run 5/16" Amsteel Blue on my winch, had it on from the day put the winch on. My dad works for a shipping line, a week before I got my winch he handed me a accident report (coincidence, I think not). No one was hurt, but from the marks on the bulkheads I saw thank goodness no one was cause it was bad. Right there and then I decided upon sythetic.
I have yet to give it a serious workout, but from what I have used it for so far, I love it, hands down. The wire rope was a PITA to deal with, especially once it was off the drum. The synthetic, it's like handling twine or something. If it breaks, well I can splice it back together in the field, no prob.
I got my stuff from rockstomper.com, they offer either a 10' abrasion protector, or 2 5' protectors. I opted for the 2 5's since I think it will be more flexible. I think having the protector(s) is the key, I'm actually going to replace mine soon with some beefier stuff from a hydrailic's shop meant to cover hoses. I used that stuff to cover the winch power wires, and I seemed like it'd be good for the rope too, since it was a little thicker.
So that's my impression, feelings and thoughts.
Chris
 
Synthetic winch line is definitely worth the money. It's much easier to use, easier to repair, safer to handle, and safer to be around if and when it breaks. If your main reason for switching to synthetic is weight you'll be in for a let down. I'd say the difference is 20-25lbs max between steel line and rope with an aluminum hawse fairlead. If you do go with synthetic keep it clean and always use a sleeve when winching against anything. You can pick up cheap sleeves at stores that carry climbing gear. They have sleeves used to cover climbing ropes, works great for winch ropes too.
 
I run a masterpull and it's been well used by myself and the friend I bought it from with the winch....I did invest in 10' of 2" Climbing webbing for a chafe guard.

One thing to remember is that a synthetic line needs maint as well...

PURPLE.JPG


Every few months (or after tons of winching in crappy ass conditions) I pull mine off and toss it in the sink with HOT water and some dish soap...mix it around and let it stew...rinse and repeat.
 
I still don't know about synthetic winch ropes. They certainly are safer than wire rope if it breaks, but can be a PITA to use. I hate those hard to work hooks that come with production winch ropes, but some who are making their own ropes use a regular hook. I've also had bad experineces with the rope getting stuck on the drum between other wraps, so we had to hook a rig up to pull the winch line out before the guy who was stuck could winch himself out. We wheel in the rocks most of the time, and it's a pain to always have someone watch the abrasion guard so the rope doesn't get fubar'd. I saw one break on our last trip, and while it just dropped harmlessly to the ground, I was very surprised to see it break so easily. It probably had been frayed slightly in that spot, but that type of damage seems to be hard to avoid. I'd hate to have one of those lines break like that while I'm hanging on it up some steep waterfall or huge ledge.

Wire ropes can be extremely dangerous if they break, but good winching technique and common sense should keep that from happening. The thing that causes damage to a wire rope is the same thing that can wedge a synthetic line between the wraps, and that is driving ahead of the winch. Most people, who don't know better, tend to drive ahead of the winch when winching, causing slack in the line. Then, when they slip again and the winch gets tight, there are loose wraps on the drum that get overwrapped by tight wraps causing kinks in the wire rope (or wraps stuck with synthetic line). These kinks are what damages the rope and where it can break in the future. Proper winching technique is to always keep the line tight when winching so the wraps on the drum are tight. I know people tend to want to (show that they can) drive, but once you have to use the winch stay on the winch and don't let slack get in the line. This is also true anytime that line is taken up on the winch, always be sure someone is holding the line to keep tension on it so no loose wraps get on the drum. Never reel in line with no tension on it, or a kink will be caused when the line is pulled tight over loose wraps. If you're on the trail and someone about to winch has loose wraps on the drum, make them stop and rewind the rope before using it. Also, if a wire rope has kinks in it, replace it.

I'm about to replace my winch line, and I like the idea of the safety and light weight of the synthetic rope, but I'm not sure I'm willing to live with the downsides. I certainly don't want to have to take it off regularly to clean it. I'll probably replace mine with another wire rope, and continue to use it carefully.

BTW, I thought a few words on proper winch technique wouldn't hurt, either. :)
 
Goat, you'll be hating life soon...looking around SEMA mostr companies are going withthe safety hooks on their stee lines as well.

I post this link all the time, and I honestly think it should be given away with every winch sold, but it's 50 pages of GOOD.
It doesn't preach Synth over steel, but just talks about what you stated....common sense and takes it to the next level; Empirical data.

http://www.pirate4x4.com/tech/billavista/Recovery/index.html

I used the steel cables for years and have seen 2 break, that's all it took for me.
 
I personally dont have a winch but I have seen both in action and I prefer the syn. rope just for the saftey reasons who cares if it frayes isint it worth it to use it just because its not nearly as dangerous. Around here to protect from damaging the rope they use old fire house its tough and free you cant beat that.
 
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