First time build, Sorry for questions

Hi all,

I'm getting an XJ soon and I want to lift it for some off roading that I plan to do in the near future. I just moved to Columbia TN, and apparently there's off road parks near me and I would like to take advantage of that. I've had XJ's in the past but I never done anything to them. I would like to change that get myself into some DIY builds of my Jeep. Only problem is I have no idea what to do, nor do I have tools or a suitable garage to do it in. If anyone would like to help me out with that that would be great. Anyway, I've been going though some ideas as what would I would like, but I don't know if it would be good for me at this present time. I'm looking for a LCOG build maybe a 3" lift and 33's. This Jeep will be a mostly DD vehicle but whenever I can and time permits it I will do off roading. I'm thinking a MT but not to aggressive of an MT something like the GY W MTR-K, Micky Thompson MTZ, Cooper STT, something along those lines.

I am currently looking at a lift that is 3" its a BDS 3" lift, I know that I want full leafs and coil springs, but I don't know what else is necessary to finish the lift. Do I need an Adj. Track bar, Steering Stabilizer, Aftermarket Adj/Fixed Upper control arms and lower, Sway Bar Disconnects, Front and rear brake lines, I'm not sure.

If someone could suggest a better lift for the price that would be great. Because its a DD I imagine that above all else I would want ride quality over off road performance, But since I also live in a Off Road friendly state I would also like to have as much fun off the road as I do on the road.

Thanks in advance.

Welcome from Brentwood, just up the road. Lots of guys here in the area.

Sounds like a good start. With 3" and 33's I would say you will need to trim your fenders, otherwise you'll be getting into them at full articulation. I wouldn't start with all the extra steering upgrades just yet. Get the lift and tires on, if you have some extra bank after that is done go with some protection - skid plates. You can do a ZJ (V8) tie-rod upgrade really cheap from the junk yard. That upgrade is good because the ZJ tie-rod is solid while the XJ one is hollow.

Keep you eyes open in the SEC forum. We try to have a wrenchfest every couple months where we all get together in a shop with a lift and work on each other's Jeeps. Just last week we got 2 axles swapped, did a full exhaust and did brake lines over a day of work. Post this up in the SEC thread and set up a wrenchfest some weekend and see who is available.

Don't know anything about the BDS lift or any of the tires that you mention, so I won't comment on that. I will tell you though, that a lot of 3" lifts will come with a rear brake line and front sway bar disconnects. My Rubicon Express did. One quick upgrade you can do is pull the rear sway bar and toss it in the trash. Also, if you want to do longer front brake lines, go to the junk yard and pull them off a Chevy truck. Finally, at 3" you may need to consider longer shocks. I got mine off a guy that upgraded a Wrangler Rubicon. It worked for a 3" lift on an XJ.

Good luck.

Thank you for the welcome.

How much do you think that I would need to trim the fenders to clear 33"s with a 3" lift? What kind of protection do you think I would need, What kind of skid plates and where?

Sounds like fun. I don't have any tools unfortunately and I don't have any knowledge of anything working with my hands in the auto mechanical field. I hope that's okay, But I am willing to learn.

This is the lift I was thinking of BDS-Suspension XJ 3" Lift Now that I look at it, it has some options to customize the lift kit, Is any extra parts needed to make this work? Or anything to make the lift better?

I was looking around the forum for lift kits in my size and I found this hybrid lift kit by DPG Off Road 3.5 HD Ultimate XJ Old Man Emu Hybrid Kit. I checked around on various sites and I've only found that OME only makes 1-2.5" Lifts for Jeeps. I'm guessing that the Hybrid is referring to Springs + Spaces, and Leafs + Blocks. Unless I am wrong then someone correct me. I also read that OME apparently has one of the best ride quality's that would be good for me considering that its a DD and a "whenever I can wheeler".

Restruction said:

Thank you for the welcome.

How much do you think that I would need to trim the fenders to clear 33"s with a 3" lift? What kind of protection do you think I would need, What kind of skid plates and where?

Click to expand...

To have any up-travel, at 3"s with 33"s, you will need to do a lot of cutting especially is you go for 12.50X 33" tires.
I run 10.50"X 33" at 4" and the flares have been moved as high as they will go and then much of the flares have been trimmed away.
For a low COG rig, the 10.50"s tuck much better.
The bumpstops will need to be increased to keep the tires out of the inner fenders.
I hope you are planning on re-gearing, 33"s, with stock gears, suck, especially in tough terrain. Low gears make it much easier to negotiate rocks and other obstacles. Budget for 4.56s and maybe a locker or two.
Gears and lockers are as valuable as taller tires IMO.
Skids- LCA skids, transfer case, gas tank, axle covers and rock rails to start. Don't forget front and back recovery points.
A lot of money and time is required to build a high quality rig.
Do it right the first time....or do it again.

I do plan on regearing, but I don't know what to regear to I'm thinking maybe 4.10's or so.
Where would I get bump stops and what size do you think need?
I like the look of wide tires, to me they just look cool, and I was told by a friend that wide tires are needed for mud (correct me if wrong).
I'll look into skid plates, anyone that I should focus on first more than others?

**Edit** What do you think of the lift kits I linked to? I like the old man emu one but I have some questions about it.

Well, you linked to two different lifts. The BDM is only an add-a-leaf and it looks like it runs about $580. You mentioned in your first post that you wanted to do a full leaf pack. The OME lift you linked to would accomplish that, but it is showing at $1300. That is quite a big jump in budget. I run a 3.5" Rubicon Express lift that came with full packs and disconnects and like it just fine for road and trail. I see that Quadratech has that lift for $585. For only $5 more than the BDM, you get full leaf packs. Plus, Quadratech is one of the sponsors and you might get a small discount on the purchase if you buy a membership ($30) and use their discount code.

Like LazyXJ said, you will have to do A LOT of trimming to run 33's. I run 31's and got away without trimming. I'm at 5.5" now thanks to coil spacers and Dodge pickup shackles, and the tallest I'd consider would be 32"s or the metric equivalent because I am not willing to trim my fenders.

Regarding gearing, yeah, 4.10s would be a good gear ratio to run. When you get to that point, the easiest (and arguably cheapest) option would be to run to the pull a parts in Lavergne and Nashville (might still be one in Lewisburg) and keep you eye out for an XJ with 4.10 from the factory and grab the front axle, then pull a Ford 8.8 out of a wrecked Explorer. Bet you could get all that done for under $400.

Regarding tires, I guess I'm just cheap so I went with what fit on the factory aluminum rims instead of purchasing different sized wheels, so mine don't stick out past the fender. You don't need wide tires to run in the mud. The tread pattern of the tire is what is going to make that different. You were told wrong.

Finally, regarding skid plates, I would start with transmission and fuel tank protection. Again, I went with factory plates. Check out the junk yards, again. As you walk the lines kick the fuel tank with your foot. If you hit one that is metal, you are set. Pull the skid and call it good. A lot of the XJs that came with the fuel tank skid also came with the tranny skid. I would bet you could get both for under $30. They made a front skid, but they are a little harder to come by.

My whole point is this - the Jeep will be a work in progress. Unless you have a huge budget and want to spend top dollar to have everything in place immediately, just work in steps. Do one project and then start to research the next step, then the next. I can promise that the Jeep will be more than capable of doing the parks around here at 3.5" with 31" tires and 3.55 gears. I know that because I ran that combo for quite awhile.

My Jeep has been under construction since July of 2009 and never did I get to a point where I had to sit back and watch other people. My basic progression was:

-Lift and tires (3.5"), front and rear bumpers
-Skid plates
-rock sliders
-new axles (geared 4.10)
-Aussie Locker
-spacers and shackles (to 5.5")
-Slip Yoke Eliminator
-transmission cooler
-Hood vents

That is 8 semi-major upgrades over a 4 year period.

This was at 3.5" with the 3.55 gears. In the first picture, notice how stuffed I am in the rear wheel well with just 31" tires on. Second picture still shows how capable it was on the rock garden.




This is at 5.5" with the 4.10 gears. Considerably more articulation. Look at the back tire. Not stuffed into the rear wheel well nearly as much. (it cost me $21 to go from 3.5" to 5.5" - $15 for the spacers from a member, and $6 for shackles from the junk yard).


Here are two side by side shots - first at 3.5" and second at 5.5" (same tires.)

Restruction said:

Hi all,

I'm getting an XJ soon and I want to lift it for some off roading that I plan to do in the near future. I just moved to Columbia TN, and apparently there's off road parks near me and I would like to take advantage of that. I've had XJ's in the past but I never done anything to them. I would like to change that get myself into some DIY builds of my Jeep. Only problem is I have no idea what to do, nor do I have tools or a suitable garage to do it in. If anyone would like to help me out with that that would be great. Anyway, I've been going though some ideas as what would I would like, but I don't know if it would be good for me at this present time. I'm looking for a LCOG build maybe a 3" lift and 33's. This Jeep will be a mostly DD vehicle but whenever I can and time permits it I will do off roading. I'm thinking a MT but not to aggressive of an MT something like the GY W MTR-K, Micky Thompson MTZ, Cooper STT, something along those lines.

I am currently looking at a lift that is 3" its a BDS 3" lift, I know that I want full leafs and coil springs, but I don't know what else is necessary to finish the lift. Do I need an Adj. Track bar, Steering Stabilizer, Aftermarket Adj/Fixed Upper control arms and lower, Sway Bar Disconnects, Front and rear brake lines, I'm not sure.

If someone could suggest a better lift for the price that would be great. Because its a DD I imagine that above all else I would want ride quality over off road performance, But since I also live in a Off Road friendly state I would also like to have as much fun off the road as I do on the road.

Thanks in advance.

Click to expand...

Holy crap someone did research! I thank you for that. Welcome. I'm from Indiana but i get down and wheel with guys in your area once a year in Harlan, KY. I am running 3" of lift(OME springs and shocks, ironrock offroad trackbar and JKS disconnects with Ironman offroad adjustable control arms) and 33's and absolutely love it. I would put a new stabilizer last on your list, hell they really aren't even needed. One thing i would definitely suggest is Armor and lots of it. You will bang sheetmetal off of things. Defintely make sure you have a transfer case skid plate and gas tank skid plate. Also, a good shock does wonders it you DD it like I do(I have a DD but its hot and the AC still works in the Jeep! ).


Here's how she sits now:


And this is why I suggest armor:


Here is a video of my Jeep in the same rock garden That Cottontail took pics in, That was at 3" of lift with 32's.

Since the video I have swapped in a Ford 8.8 rear axle and geared the front to match. I'm also running a front locker.

Side Note: If you get a chance meet up with some SEC guys, great bunch of folks down there!

I can do the off road parks around here with 31's and 3.5" lift? That actually makes me really REALLY happy, its just less money I have to spend ATM. Thank you Cottontail, You literally just saved me a load of money, Do you think I could possible squeeze 32's on a 3 or 3.5" lift? The BDS does come with full packs you just need to enable it in the customization option. If I add the full spring options to the BDS it just bearly rivals the OME DPG lift by about $50. I did some searching last night online on this forum and I found a site called JCROffroad and I looked at their bumpers, I think I will go with one of theirs, they would be good for what I would like from them. Right now I'm looking for an XJ as a DD and a weekend warrior that's 5 speed.

Both of you have Rigs I would love to have, I can't wait to start building up my XJ.

I like to do research before I post, and if I cant find it on the search forum then I post a good post . I've been a lurker on many forums so I kinda know how it works as not to make people mad at me .

Restruction said:

Do you think I could possible squeeze 32's on a 3 or 3.5" lift? .

Click to expand...

You saw the tire stuff on my Jeep with 31's on 3.5", but then again....look at Aaron's driveway shot. He is doing a 33 on the lift height you are considering. Also, take look at the amount of trimming he had to do...especially in the front. Doesn't look like he did much in the back. I've seen him run Betsy too...very capable rig and driver.

Regarding your comment, and maybe to clarify my statement about doing the parks in the SE on 31s and 3-3.5" - there will be trails you simply can't run and will need to take a bypass on, but I've never found a park that didn't hold my interest with what I could do. As long as you know your rig and your capabilities as a driver, you'll be fine. Probably the biggest pet peeve anyone has on the trails are people trying to overdrive their capacity and having to spend time doing trail repairs or extractions due to carelessness. That said, breakdowns and stucks happen, but they are more palatable to the other drivers when they happen within a driver's capabilities.

The guys down here are built too all sorts of specifications, and the one thing I've learned, is that everyone is conscious of and supportive of everyone else's abilities and the more experienced drivers are very willing to help new people learn, spot for each other, and patient enough to allow the beginning drivers to test their abilities before moving down the trail. I've ridden with other clubs, and I will say that last statement was geared towards the crowd - not necessarily some of the other clubs in middle Tennessee.

The worst thing you could do, in my opinion, is to try to build the rig to be what you think other people will be tolerant of. Build it to what you are comfortable with.

I had a friend back from where I moved from who had a TJ that was lifted with a very small lift, he called it a leveling kit, I called it spacers. But he has 32's and I liked the look of them, not to small, not to big it looked good in my eyes. I know that XJ's are completely different but if I could achieve that look it would be great without trimming. If not I can live with it, As you said, I should build it to my specifications not what others think I should do. I know my limit as a driver, and I can safely say that I am very poor off road, I've tried it back in CT before with horrible results. But it only made me want to get better.

If anyone thinks that I can fit 32's on 3.5" of lift without trimming that would just be perfect. If not I'll stick to 31's I really should start small shouldn't I?

Restruction said:

I had a friend back from where I moved from who had a TJ that was lifted with a very small lift, he called it a leveling kit, I called it spacers. But he has 32's and I liked the look of them, not to small, not to big it looked good in my eyes. I know that XJ's are completely different but if I could achieve that look it would be great without trimming. If not I can live with it, As you said, I should build it to my specifications not what others think I should do. I know my limit as a driver, and I can safely say that I am very poor off road, I've tried it back in CT before with horrible results. But it only made me want to get better.

If anyone thinks that I can fit 32's on 3.5" of lift without trimming that would just be perfect. If not I'll stick to 31's I really should start small shouldn't I?

Click to expand...

Winner, winner chicken dinner. Yeah, the TJ, and JK guys can do a lot that we can't. Simple platform differences.

What are you driving now? You could come up to Wishbone Ranch in Bowling Green this weekend. There are 3 or 4 of us heading up there for a day trip.

I'm kinda busy for the next couple weeks trying to get settled with the area, I just moved to TN, I'm actually also trying to sell my current WJ. I don't think I will get much out of it. But its got a nice aftermarket sound system.

On a side note, what do you think of the lift kits?

**Edit** What would be some good mud terrain tires for around here that's also good in the insane rain we get here in TN, I would like to keep it a Mud terrain for the off roading. I just want an mt thats bearable for the street also.

Why not wheel the wj? My wife's 01 wj was keeping up on most trails in the parks out here on stock suspension and tires. Sure she used the heck out of the skid plates, but she was making it just fine. Of course once you catch the bug it escalates quick. Now she runs 6" of lift, 35's, long arms, and an aussie in the rear. And for those who say you can't stuff 33's, here's her wj stuffing 35x12.50's. yes there is some major trimming done.


Here's an older one with no trimming in the rear, only removed the plastic bumper cover.

Or break out the sawsall and make em fit. 35x14.50's on my xj with 6.5" lift, still had 5-6" of uptravel before the bumpstops.

That's a sick WJ, I wanted to do stuff like that to my WJ, but I miss having an XJ.

get some 3.5 or 4.5 RE coils from serious off road (4.5s are like less than 80$ shipped, since they have about the same prices as mud flaps.com, just they are a naxja vendor) . get a used second stock pack and some used shackles for next to nothing. then buy some used monotubes if you can find em, if not, get em new. Bilstien, RE are rebadged bilstiens, etc.

dont buynew control arms, watch craigslist and even more watch your local naxja chapter. I have sold countless rubicon express uppers and lowers all adjustable for around 100-140$ for all 4 arms. Rustys stuff is usually given away for free, rough country arm might bring in 20$, so there.

get a good double shear trackbar and mount, used or new. if used , make sure the joints are good.

get a new ZJ v8 tie rod. you can get all the parts for like 60$ shipped on rockauto, or something like that.

cut fenders and bumpstop for 33s on a 3.5" lift. I did for a year or two, wasnt too bad after bumpstoppping.

for a DD id go a/t. Id consider 31s or 32s for a DD also if you're not going to regear, unless your commute is only a mile in each direction. then do whatever you want.

ditch rear sway bar, for the front make some homebrew discos with some wing nuts and some hitch pins for the bottom.

for brake lines, use a 96 dodge dakota rear line, and for the front use 95 GMC 2wd 3/4 ton truck lines. they will all bolt right up and are about 6" longer.
I ran this brake line setup for years.

inner (JCR 4 bolt) and outer (make something from some 1/4" plate) for the steering box, along with the across brace that bolts right above the pitman shaft.

go to junk yard and get some factory skids like t case and gas tank.

this should be a good start.

then buy some used sliders for 100$ on naxja , find a used winch bumper down the road , and the rear tire bumper same thing.

FlexdXJ said:

http://s192.photobucket.com/user/GLi8v/media/tree_zpsc1798ce6.jpg.html

Here is a video of my Jeep in the same rock garden That Cottontail took pics in, That was at 3" of lift with 32's.

Click to expand...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QCggVHwm540

I forgot to link to this earlier for you! :doh: give you an idea of why i'm trimmed and all that good stuff.

Restruction said:

I do plan on regearing, but I don't know what to regear to I'm thinking maybe 4.10's or so.
.

Click to expand...

Having run 31"s and 33"s, on both 4.11s and 4.56, I would definitely say 4.56. The mileage didn't drop with the 4.56s and it is a whole lot more fun to drive. and doesn't downshift every time the road heads uphill a bit.
Mine is a DD so mileage and driveability are both important considerations.
I was warned many years ago, by some of the more experienced local members (including Cal), that going from 3.55s to 4.11s was the wrong move and that I would regret it...they were right.
Remember, you are adding a bunch of weight and lifting it, which makes it even less aerodynamically efficient.

Very nice video, Thank you for it. I think I will most likely stay with 31's for now, I don't really want to trim just yet. Unless anyone thinks I can run 32's with no trimming on 3.5"s of lift.

Just a question so please don't yell at me, Wouldn't it be easier for someone who's never done this before to get a complete kit first rather than try to piece it together? I'm very new at this so I don't know what to look for or what to get in a junk yard. I'm very much into ride quality as of right now, because in about 2 years I have to find a way to get this Jeep back up to CT.

Restruction said:

Just a question so please don't yell at me, Wouldn't it be easier for someone who's never done this before to get a complete kit first rather than try to piece it together? I'm very new at this so I don't know what to look for or what to get in a junk yard. I'm very much into ride quality as of right now, because in about 2 years I have to find a way to get this Jeep back up to CT.

Click to expand...

Set up a time to do some junkyard searching, invite a couple of the SEC guys to join you and have them help you search out parts. Cost you a day and maybe a couple burgers at McDonalds. Learn by helping/watching.

But yes, it would be easiest just to get a full kit ordered.