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jeep wont start nss switch is new?

Draven1474

NAXJA Forum User
Location
ogden
2000 jeep Cherokee with aw4 transmission, I just replaced the nss switch because I was having the occasional no start problem then It got worse to the point were it wont start no matter how much I mess with the shifter or plug, so it has a brand new nss and still no start for the life of it, I pulled the started and ignition fuses and relays but all looks good as far as I can tell. any help is much obliged
 
I put some jumper cables on it, turned it over noting, then tried again and it started, drove around the block shut it off turn it over again noting the again and nothing the third time it started, so do I need a new battery or starter?
 
my bad nothing as in no starter, I can hear a relay clicking, the battery connections are good but ill clean the ones at the starter.
 
Hit the starter with a pipe or a hammer a few times. Bet she'll fire right up. Strike it hard enough to free up sticky parts, but not hard enough to break it.
 
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is that a joke? but wouldn't surprise me (stupid jeeps) I took both the starter and battery to o'reily to have them tested and both were good installed them and it fired right up, maby bad connection at the starter but there clean now, but I need this jeep to get me around, so is there anything more I can do so it stays reliable other then hit the starter with a pipe
 
Starter solenoid and or brushes may be on their last legs. Sometimes a jolt gets them working again, but it won't last. Also could be a battery about to suddenly die. They both give early warnings and sometimes test good, just before they kick the bucket for good.
 
I keep a set pf brushes in the garage for situations just like this. Two schools of thought, buy a rebuilt starter with a guarantee and just swap it when it falls or replace the brushes in the starter you have.

I usually go with the second option, at east I know what I have a starter with worn brushse, with a rebuilt who knows what I'm getting? The rebuild may have other parts on their last legs,. like the overrunning clutch questionable bearings or crispy windings.

I keep a junkyard (extra) starter for all my XJ's. Mud sometimes finds it's way into the brushes. Oil leaking onto the starter sometimes finds it's way onto the brushes. Sometimes the brushes just wear until they get too short to make reliable contact.
 
picked up a multi tester and believe that the battery cables have a break in them, I know 5-90 makes some nice ones but how do you go about ordering a set of them
 
thought I had this resolved by cleaning connections but it came back today at the worst possible time and left me stranded, until I put a jumper lead to the starter and then fired right up. so the starter is good, battery is good, now what could it be? the starter relay? because I don't think I can here a tick anymore when I try to start it
 
Starter solenoid and or brushes may be on their last legs. Sometimes a jolt gets them working again, but it won't last. Also could be a battery about to suddenly die. They both give early warnings and sometimes test good, just before they kick the bucket for good.
 
yea I get that, I smacked the bottom of the starter real hard with a hammer get back in turn the key and nothing happens, I take a jumper wire touch it to the starter lead from the battery turns over immediately, bench test it turns over immediately, so how can it be the starter?
 
yea I get that, I smacked the bottom of the starter real hard with a hammer get back in turn the key and nothing happens, I take a jumper wire touch it to the starter lead from the battery turns over immediately, bench test it turns over immediately, so how can it be the starter?

Testing is not conclusive it the brushes are on their last legs, or the solenoid is almost shot.

You bypassed the solenoid on the starter the last time, did you not? That indicates the solenoid on the starter is toast.
 
Testing is not conclusive it the brushes are on their last legs, or the solenoid is almost shot.

You bypassed the solenoid on the starter the last time, did you not? That indicates the solenoid on the starter is toast.

assuming he put power to the small terminal on the starter (the only way it would engage the starter drive and turn the motor) than the solenoid and starter are functioning correctly when they get the proper input.

I'd look at a failed NSS, starter relay, or a broken wire from the relay to the solenoid.
 
assuming he put power to the small terminal on the starter (the only way it would engage the starter drive and turn the motor) than the solenoid and starter are functioning correctly when they get the proper input.

This is true I never bypassed the solenoid, Im almost certain the starter motor and solenoid is in perfect running shape (turns over every time I put power directly to it) , I switched fuel pump relay and starter relay today so if my engine just cranks and cranks then I guess well find the culprit hopefully, I hate how sometimes it happens and sometimes it doesn't, ill post back if I figure it out-thanks
 
You can visually inspect the brushes, not that big of a deal. Mark the three starter sections to make realignment and reassembly easier, just in case a section gets twisted so you you don't have to go fishing with the long bolts. Take the back end cap off.

The braided wire going to the brushes is pretty stiff, as the brushes get shorter, the spring pushing on the end of the brushes gets weaker. You can sometimes rearrange the wire a little and get some more use out of the brushes.

Tapping on the side of the starter, can seat the brushes in the holder a little deeper and get you a few more starts.

Jumping the starter at the solenoid may help the brushes arch the gap, the wire from the starter relay to the solenoid is pretty anemic and can choke off some of the current.

Getting the end cap back on the starter is a pain, but doable and is a lot easier with three or four hands. You have to compress the four brushes to get the cap back on.

Taking the solenoid off the starter is to be avoided, the bolts are almost guaranteed to be be welded in place and there is a good chance of snapping them off. Solenoids rarely fail anyway, I've only seen one bad on in 26 years and that was rust from a torn seal and not an electrical failure.

Mud in the brushes (yes it does find it's way in there) and oil on brushes (yes it does find it's way in there) does about the same thing as worn brushes, you get iffy function on the starter. Sometimes the starter works and sometimes it doesn't, it all depends on enough current finding a path through the brushes.

It may be something else, but brushes, especially on a thirteen year old starter, are a prime suspect. It has been my experience the brushes last around 6 years depending on how often the starter gets full of muddy water or oil. It the starter gets full of muddy water (and/or sand) the brushes can wear down pretty quickly.

A new brush is 3/4" long, when it wears 3/8" the wire going to the brush jams against the brush holder.
 
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so can I just tear apart the starter clean it and replace the brushes, or is it more complicated then just buying new brushes and installing them?
 
so can I just tear apart the starter clean it and replace the brushes, or is it more complicated then just buying new brushes and installing them?

Sometimes a cleaning will do the trick. especially if you open the end and it is full of dried muddy water or oil. You can inspect the brushes and even measure the length, less than a half inch is marginal 3/8 inch long and they are likely shot. GoJeep has a good write up on starter clean and refurbish.

Last I checked the two pair of brushes costs around $30 with the mounting plate for one pair. Most people opt for a rebuilt starter with a guarantee.

First check it out and see if there are any issues with your brushes.

My oil filter adapter was leaking oil onto my starter. Logic would tell you the oil would run off and not find it's way into the starter. The fact is the oil does find it's way into the starter and coats the brushes.

The numbers for the brushes you can find in the Crown jeep site and you can order with these numbers from Quadra Tech, Summit or whatever. The down side is they are double the price they used to be.

The only thing you have to watch out for is there is a thrust washer or spacer on the end of the shaft (on some starters). Two basic models, one has a bushing for the shaft, the other has bearings. The model with the bushings has the thrust washer and it is easily lost, but not critical for function if it is lost.

Not much messes up with these starters, they are well designed. I've put new brushes in a few junk yard starters and keep one with me when wheeling in the mud. I still have my 1987 starter.
 
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