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View Full Version : So that's what that noise was..... Opinions?


WildernessJeep
May 7th, 2013, 18:41
So I'm running a 98 XJ, with 31's and ARB's in both axles. I was getting silly up in the snow/mountains and thought I popped a U-joint in the long side shaft. I got it home and pulled the shaft to replace the U-joint and find this:

https://fbcdn-sphotos-h-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-snc6/p206x206/249192_326123884182991_2059948471_n.jpg

https://fbcdn-sphotos-e-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-frc1/p206x206/428644_326123774183002_586583201_n.jpg



So I think these were the stock axles, maybe not. They are definately 27 spline (which means the locker is too).

Everything I see on the Superior website is 30 spline, and $1,000 or more. Should I just run down and get a set from a junkyard? I live in a big city and can probably pick up non-specialty parts from a local drivetrain store.

Opinions?? Are the superior "super 30" axles worth triple the cost?


Also, I can't get the broken stub out of the carrier, so thus the carrier won't come out. I thought about turning the Jeep sidways and shaking it up and down, but figured there must be an easier way.

Thanks.

Talyn
May 7th, 2013, 19:15
Also, I can't get the broken stub out of the carrier, so thus the carrier won't come out. I thought about turning the Jeep sidways and shaking it up and down, but figured there must be an easier way.


You are going to have to push the stub out. There is kind of a retaining circlip on the end of the shaft. If the shaft was intact a bit of a tug would get the shaft out.

Ratrod25
May 7th, 2013, 21:12
Maybe you can pull the center pin and find something long and drive it out from the drivers side. Factory ten makes stronger replacement axles in 27 spline. And they have a Ten year warranty from what I hear.

the_weirdo
May 8th, 2013, 00:16
The machining makes me think those are stock shafts. I personally won't pay for 30-spline D30 shafts because it is most often the ujoint that breaks and the 30-splines don't solve that problem. I have actually not ever seen a long side break, I've seen plenty of short sides break, but not the long side. Add in that if you bust a 30-spline shaft, you probably can't find a spare on the trail because very few people run them - almost everyone runs 27-spline shafts. A

Comanchedude
May 8th, 2013, 08:17
you may have to drive the broken piece out front the other side like said above you can take the cross shaft out of the carrier. (there is no retaining circlip on the end of the shaft)
as for shafts you can use scrap yard replacements.

BADaXJ
May 8th, 2013, 08:50
To me, it doesn't make much sense to run an ARB with stock shafts. I ran stock shafts on 33's with 760 joints. Ended up breaking the long side shaft right at the splines, the two broken pieces rode up on each other and spread the carrier enough to split the innner bearing race. I'm runnning ten factory alloys now and I am happy. Got them from summit for a round $500 shipped.

BADaXJ
May 8th, 2013, 09:33
Here are two reasons why I don't want my shafts to be the "fuse"

http://imageshack.us/a/img832/5916/dsc02944xw.jpg

http://imageshack.us/a/img13/4084/b5653e4adb1d404db4ae8f8.jpg

Ratrod25
May 8th, 2013, 21:57
You can get exploded views of the locker on arbs website and you can order single parts that are damaged.

ROBZ95Xj
May 8th, 2013, 22:07
Here are two reasons why I don't want my shafts to be the "fuse"

http://imageshack.us/a/img832/5916/dsc02944xw.jpg

http://imageshack.us/a/img13/4084/b5653e4adb1d404db4ae8f8.jpg
cause a blown up R&P is so much better

WildernessJeep
May 8th, 2013, 22:13
Can I drive it out from the other (short) side through the ARB? I don't remember if it has an open shaft down the center to drive it, or if I am just going to hammer on the locker (not a great idea).

*89Laredo*
May 8th, 2013, 22:16
cause a blown up R&P is so much better

Lockouts FTW.

ROBZ95Xj
May 8th, 2013, 22:17
have you tried to pull the carrier yet?

ROBZ95Xj
May 8th, 2013, 22:18
Lockouts FTW.
dont do shit when you stuck on a hard trail in 2wd

WildernessJeep
May 8th, 2013, 22:29
have you tried to pull the carrier yet?


Yes. It's stuck on the long side. I tried lightly tapping from the short side with a small diameter stock that I had. It didn't come out readily, but like I said, I can't tell if I'm hitting the broken end of the axle, or on something inside the locker that I would probably regret really hammering on.

VAhasnoWAVES
May 8th, 2013, 22:57
powerful magnet to pull the broken part of the shaft out? though fishing through the long side may be tough...

*89Laredo*
May 8th, 2013, 23:40
dont do shit when you stuck on a hard trail in 2wd

Lockouts act as fuses instead of shafts or gears...

ROBZ95Xj
May 9th, 2013, 00:16
Lockouts act as fuses instead of shafts or gears...
ive only seen a lockout break once, before the shaft or ujoints with D44's or 60's, never seen em on a 30 waste of money for lockouts on a 30

WildernessJeep
May 9th, 2013, 02:53
powerful magnet to pull the broken part of the shaft out? though fishing through the long side may be tough...


I tried that. It seems to be lodged, and the end is rounded so it doesn't have a solid face for the magnet to grab onto.

kastein
May 9th, 2013, 08:20
Looking at the exploded diagram on quadratec there is unfortunately a cross shaft that will keep you from driving it out from the other side.

Sucks, I hope it didn't munch up the ARB like the first pic BADaXJ posted.

What gears are you running? Any chance you can just say screw it, cut shit apart around the locker, repair it if necessary, slap it in another d30 from the junkyard and keep wheeling? The one nice thing about running 3.55s in my rig is that I can do that without spending more than $130, in fact usually I've gotten em for $free, once from ROBZ95Xj in fact. Otherwise, the gearing sucks :laugh2:

BADaXJ
May 9th, 2013, 09:09
When mine was stuck in the splines, I had to use a very thin piece of flat stock from the other side. It was thin enough to slide by the cross pin. Looks like the ARB has 3 cross pins, forming a cross. Unfortunately this leaves you with a lot less room, but a small enough piece of round stock may do the trick. Last resort, you may have to cut the bearings so the carrier can come out at an angle...

BADaXJ
May 9th, 2013, 09:14
cause a blown up R&P is so much better

In my opinion, yes. I have countless hours of bracket fab into my housing for the coilovers and otk steering etc. The housing is already messed up from the last break I had. If the housing gets trashed, swapping in a new housing would be a ton of work since I'd have to strip it and rebuild all the brackets and truss. Not to mention, would you rather have 2wd on a tough trail, or separate the knuckle from the inner c completely and try to get out of that "difficult" trail with only 3 wheels attached and the housing dragging through the mud and rocks? That's just the way I look at it. Also, even cost wise the ring and pinion is better than an expensive locker setup, like an ARB.

kastein
May 9th, 2013, 09:31
I'd rather separate a knuckle or blow a ujoint than anything else.

Why? The devil I know vs the devil I don't. I can (and have) slapped new shafts in, forced balljoints back together, and/or replaced balljoints on the trail and continued wheeling. It meant limping home after getting out of the woods, but I still had functional 4x4 and didn't need any winching.

Also, much less chance of permanent housing damage than a blown R&P, carrier, or shaft right at the splines - I've seen pics from other NAXJA members who had a chunk of ring gear tooth get stuck in the wrong spot and punch a hole through the side of the pumpkin. Not good, diff went from rebuildable to junk the second they discovered that. I think it was shortxjdoug who posted it.

WildernessJeep
May 14th, 2013, 21:04
Well I got the carrier out. Anybody ever rebuild an ARB? The broken long side axle ate up the splines, seal, bearings and races.

bobnoxious
May 15th, 2013, 06:48
cause a blown up R&P is so much better

This. (I know this was sarcasm, and I agree)


Lockouts act as fuses instead of shafts or gears...

No they don't.

WildernessJeep
May 15th, 2013, 08:11
Is this ARB rebuildable? How hard is rebuilding an ARB? Anyone ever do it?

https://fbcdn-sphotos-f-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/480437_329249307203782_1802559486_n.jpg

https://fbcdn-sphotos-h-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash3/486728_329249123870467_2102873405_n.jpg

kastein
May 15th, 2013, 08:43
Damn... with the carrier bearing looking like that, check to see if the carrier bearing race swelled enough to damage the housing bearing cap. I'd almost bet on the housing being damaged too :(

You need a new ARB carrier half and probably some other stuff, start pulling it apart, figure out which parts are damaged, and get on the horn with ARB. IIRC they actually do sell repair parts for their lockers.

BADaXJ
May 15th, 2013, 14:22
Yikes, that looks pretty rough. My bearing caps weren't in very good shape after my damage, and I'd bet yours may be out of spec after that! Inspect them very carefully, and use a new outer race to mock them up and make sure the caps aren't stretched and out of whack. On a side note, I'd replace a ring and pinion any day over that. This could result in a new housing, new ARB, new shafts and possibly a ring and pinion any way if it's pitted...

WildernessJeep
May 15th, 2013, 16:34
So this is the inside of the passenger side axle housing. It looks like the bearing seat is clean. Some damage around the seal, but I can RTV, can't I? The damage inside the tube is mostly superficial and inconsequential, right? Anyone see anything I don't?

https://fbcdn-sphotos-f-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-prn1/942138_329406283854751_188878134_n.jpg

BADaXJ
May 15th, 2013, 18:44
The inside of the tube should be ok. The main concern is the bearing seat and the bearing cap. Inspect them carefully to make sure they aren't deformed or stretched from the bearing coming apart. The rtv shouldn't be an issue, it just seals the tube to the housing and what you see it excess that smooshed out. You'll obviously need a new inner seal for the shaft though.