Air Tools

[Cottontail]

Ok...so I just recently got a 21 gallon Central Pneumatics compressor.

Specs from the sticker:
4.9 SCFM @ 90 psi
7 SCFM @ 40 psi
115 maximum pressure (however, cuts off at higher than that)

As well, I have a Craftsman 1/2" impact wrench and a Craftsman 3/8" air ratchet.

I am trying to strip down an axle I just bought but neither of these tools will tork off any of the bolts/nuts I need loosened. They just spin hard and fast in mid air, but when secured to a bolt/nut, they make the ratcheting/impact noise, but the head stays put.

For reference, I am trying to remove the hub nut, the nuts holding on the calipers, the nuts holding on the steering knuckle, and the bolt holding on the lower control arm/

My wonder....are the tools just crap? Is the compressor not giving enough power? Are the bolts just that stubborn?

The only thing I have used this compressor for is the air hammer and filling the tires on my Jeep. Never used the ratchet or impact wrench so I have no prior experience...just an unrealistic (it seems) expectation that these would have been removed pretty easily with the air tools.

Thoughts?

[RCP Phx]

That not a big enough compressor for most air tools.I have a 80gal/12cfm@90psi and can still run in down.

[Cottontail]

Hmmm....

the specs on the tools are that the:

ratchet needs 5.5 @ 90 PSI...so I am about .6 shy

wrench needs 5 @ 90 PSI...so I am about .1 shy

Outside of buying a bigger tank, do I have options?

[Cottontail]

Here is another thought...will this work?

I have a 3 gallon compressor also.

Could I get a coupler and run hoses from each compressor to the coupler then one hose from the coupler to the air tool to get more psi behind it?

Is that just asking for trouble???

[RenegadeStang]

That's not too great of a spec on the compressor, and you have to factor in what kinda torque your impact has. Not all are created equal. :D

[RCP Phx]

When talking about the "less expensive" compressors,they are usually "overated" based on some "interesting" numbers(so basically those are under IDEAL test conditions).Also theres a difference in performance between "airless/oil" types(besides the obvious noise difference).

[heyhar]

I have a 28 gallon, 150psi Campbell Hausfeld that I got at Lowes a few years ago. I will let it build up till is shuts off, turn the regulator on full, and with the 20 year old Craftsman gun I have, it will undo the hub/axle nut, the torque spec of which is 170lb/ft. The only time this combo may let me down is lower control arms. Anything like this, I'll start with the breaker bar, with a 3' piece of 1" EMT conduit on it. If it doesn't want to come loose, this will snap it! The compressor isn't rated for painting, although I've done a fair share of it, just let it keep up with you. The 150psi gives you a good shot of power, although you'll use it quickly, and the motor won't come back till it's down to 100psi. It's probably the biggest I could run on 120 volts, and although it's next to my breaker panel, with easy access to 240 volts, I wanted it to remain portable, as I've used it elsewhere on my property.

[kastein]

I've honestly never had trouble with LCA bolts, I just crank em out with an 18-20" breaker bar. No heat required. Pinion nuts on loose, unsecured axles are all I've really had to use a cheater bar on.

My dinky little 1 gallon husky air compressor is really, really not up to the task of running my IR impact gun. Heck, it can't even really keep up with a decent HVLP spray gun.

[iwannadie]

Finally I am stepping into the world of air tools.

I've had my craftsman professional 240volt compressor sitting in my garage forever now putting off the additional outlet until now. It's rated at 10cfm at 90psi and something like 15cfm at 40psi. I'm hoping it will treat me well for what I need as I slowly add air tools.

I ordered my first impact gun, went with the IR Thunder Gun for 200 bucks. I almost stepped up to their titanium line but it only offered a slight peak torque gain and doesn't look or sound as cool ; p . I can't wait to try it all out next weekend, I'm going to be doing nascar pit challenges in my garage for days!

Can anyone recommend a good air hose? I'm looking at the legacy flexzilla 3/8 hose, I only need a 25ft run in my 2 car garage should be plenty. I was also going to grab a set of legacy quick connectors too.

[kastein]

I would just use soldered copper water pipe for the in/on-wall portions, and I have been using my yellow 1/4 (or is it 3/8? not sure) home depot coiled air line for years now without problems. It's good to 140psi iirc.

[stewie]

I would just use soldered copper water pipe for the in/on-wall portions, and I have been using my yellow 1/4 (or is it 3/8? not sure) home depot coiled air line for years now without problems. It's good to 140psi iirc.

once i get myself a decent compressor to replace my hf pos, i pan on piping my garage for compressed air.

[iwannadie]

I would just use soldered copper water pipe for the in/on-wall portions, and I have been using my yellow 1/4 (or is it 3/8? not sure) home depot coiled air line for years now without problems. It's good to 140psi iirc.

MY garage isn't big enough to worry about running pipe along the walls, a 20 foot hose would reach wall to wall I'm sure.

[MAY POP]

Cottontail,With that compressor you should be able to break loose bolts. The thing is you need to get 90 to 120 psi to the 1/2 air impact. The air ratchet is useless. Can you tell us what the size of the outlet to the air hose is? The bigger the better. If its 1/4" than its to small. It is restricting the air flow.Is there a large pipe plug on the tank that can be remove to install a ball valve than a high flow quick disconnect. The next thing is to see what you max pressure is. The HIGHER the better. I would bet the pressure switch can be turned up to give you more pressure. You must check what your output pressure is?
Next is get a larger diamiter hose. 3/8 minimum But for a tiny compressor a 1/2 hose is better. It lets what little air you have get used effecently.
Last but not least is you air impact. First oil it with airtool oil. It helps alot to oil it . If you dont have airtool oil ATF is just as good.
Another thing is that your impact might just be junk. The best impact BANG for your buck is the I.R. 231. There is nothing on a Jeep it wont break loose quickly. It can be had for around 120 bucks on the web.
Feel free to PM me and Ill call you back and walk you through each of these steps to make the equipment you have work.
Ron

[kastein]

That's the impact gun I have. It failed to break loose some factory UCA bolts on a d30 I bought (with the gun on the highest torque setting.) I proceeded to remove them with a 20" breaker bar and one arm.

My compressor sucks, but I was a bit underwhelmed. I'm hoping it will perform better with a higher pressure compressor and a larger tank.

[iwannadie]

That's the impact gun I have. It failed to break loose some factory UCA bolts on a d30 I bought (with the gun on the highest torque setting.) I proceeded to remove them with a 20" breaker bar and one arm.

My compressor sucks, but I was a bit underwhelmed. I'm hoping it will perform better with a higher pressure compressor and a larger tank.

Which impact gun, there's been several mentioned in the thread ha.

[kastein]

The IR 231C - it's probably largely due to my compressor, but I mean seriously... it still should have managed to beat me one-armed.

[iwannadie]

The IR 231C - it's probably largely due to my compressor, but I mean seriously... it still should have managed to beat me one-armed.

Ok, that's what I figured but just wanted to be sure.

I'm hoping my choice of impact gun works out. The whole point is to knock off stuck on fasteners. I'll be sad if I have to use a breaker bar after all this ha.

[MAY POP]

If you have an IR231 and its not breaking loose bolts than your compressor is not giving you enough pressure. That is the best of the normally priced guns. Always set the output pressure as high as possible.
Ron

[souske]

Also try grabbing the socket with your free hand and twisting it in the direction you are trying to go.

The compressor should be fine, I built my Jeep using a devilbiss 1.5 hp 3gal, patience is key. Might try a little Kroil as well.

And good luck with the hub nuts. If they havent been broken loose already, I would put that hub/axle in your axle housing on the jeep and go at it with the breaker bar and cheater pipe.

[kastein]

I usually break hub nuts free with a 20" breaker bar and a spare tire. Toss the unit bearing in the spare tire, thread a few lugnuts on loosely to keep it there, hold the tire vertical and sit on it, then grab the breaker bar and go to town.

[Jeepman401]

A 21 gallon tank should give you some initial power. It doesn't matter what the compressor puts out, if you have a full tank, and the gun doesn't have that initial power, its the gun.
I do work all the time using a 3 gallon compressor, with the pressure cranked up, and the tank full, I can take off quite a bit.

[iwannadie]

Just an impromptu review of my thunder gun.

This thing is awesome... I got it all hooked up today with a 3/8" hose, decided to hold off on the 1/2" hose for now. I let my compressor build to 130 psi and set my regulator to 90 psi and off I went with my ingersoll rand impact lug sockets. First lug nut was off before I even realized I hit the trigger...! I was able to remove all my lug nuts and play around a bit before my compressor had to kick on. When the compressor did kick on it was only for a few seconds to fully recover and had enough for me to screw around with again for a while. I was expecting the compressor to run a Lot but it was hardly taxed at all. I got pretty good with the impact to zip the lugs back on at about 80 ft lbs, enough for me to then use my torque wrench for the final pass.

I read a lot of reviews saying it was too heavy, it is certainly heavy but I don't see it as a problem at all for me. I am not going to use it all day like some professionals however. I also read about people having air leaks at the fitting, no problems there for me so far.

It sounds awesome and the free spool speed is just amazing to witness. The sound for me is close enough to the nascar pit crew that I'm happy with just playing with it to hear that sound.

My only complaint is the adjust knob is a little small and placed in a tight area, my big fingers have a little trouble getting to it. Not a huge deal at all and it is slotted so I could use a flat head screw driver if it was really a problem.

[slimpartywagon]

Here is a trick from a PRO... when the impact fails to turn the fastener when trying to remove it, try tightening the fastener with the impact, then switch to loosen and hit it again.. repeat several times.. while impacting, ratchet the impact gun clockwise while tightening and counter-clockwise while loosening... eventually it will break loose, or the fastener will break.. one of the two... also soak the fastener in pb blaster overnight.. and spray it down one more time right before you try to break it loose. Hope this helps. I have been doing it this way for years with great success, I probably have broken a dozen bolts doing it this way..

[iwannadie]

What do you guys think about air drills? I am seriously in the market for a drill and am now debating on air or corded. My main use for a drill over the years has always been to drill out broken bolts and holes into sheet metal, nothing major.

Would an air drill suit my needs given my compressor is pretty stout and I have air wherever I would need a drill? What are the advantages / disadvantages of air drills?

[RCP Phx]

What do you guys think about air drills? I am seriously in the market for a drill and am now debating on air or corded. My main use for a drill over the years has always been to drill out broken bolts and holes into sheet metal, nothing major.

Would an air drill suit my needs given my compressor is pretty stout and I have air wherever I would need a drill? What are the advantages / disadvantages of air drills?

They have their purpose but consume alot of air,better have a big compressor/tank.

[iwannadie]

They have their purpose but consume alot of air,better have a big compressor/tank.

What would their main purpose be, I'm still trying to figure out the pros of having an air drill. Are they more powerful, faster, lighter, smaller or what?

My compressor runs at like 10 cfm at 90 psi and the air drill I was eyeing requires 4 cfm at 90 psi so I should be fine there. If an electric drill has more power though I would just assume get that, they are about the same cost.

[alex22]

The air drills are much louder than a corded drill, but have less torque which can be nice for some jobs. The tools I use for crack repair and tapping holes are pneumatic so they are less likely to break off a drill or tap in a block or head. I use an electric drill, corded or cordless for any other job I have to do.

Another reason you see a lot of mechanics using air drills is that most shops are set up with drop lines for air and not extension cords.

[heyhar]

Running a couple-horsepower motor to spin a compressor to fill a tank to run a drill to drill a hole makes for a very expensive hole! IMHO, anyone contemplating a pneumatic drill should already have an assortment of corded and cordless drills of various sizes and strengths, and the air drill is probably most useful to someone in a shop already plumbed for air, as previously suggested. I've got all manner of air tools in my garage, but unless the compressor is full, the cordless stuff, especially the impact gun, gets my vote. I even have drill bits for the gun.....

[iwannadie]

Ok, thanks guy. I guess it makes sense when thinking of a shop having the air hose available easier than a power cord.

I'll look at a quality corded drill first before an air drill seeing as I have power or air in the same place. I'm not a fan of cordless, the batteries always seem to last only so long. Then, the company switches to a new type of battery or the replacement batteries cost too much to make them worth while. For my needs I will have power anywhere I need a drill so cordless isn't needed.

[alex22]

Look around for a second hand tool store or a pawn shop. I've picked up some power tools for a good deal at those types of places.

[Jeepman401]

The main benifit of an air drill is that with a cheap air regulator, you can easily control the drill speed, and slow it down to a more bit friendly speed

[kastein]

Look around for a second hand tool store or a pawn shop. I've picked up some power tools for a good deal at those types of places.
X2, I just got my husqvarna 136 chainsaw for 75 bucks at the local pawn shop. Price tag said 269 (they way overinflate the stickers to make you feel better about the "discounted" price, keep that in mind) and I seemed almost interested, so he dropped the price to 100, then said he'd take 75 since it didn't have any gas in it and I couldn't try it out on the spot. Gave me a day to try it and bring it back if it was busted, it worked so I kept it. Don't be afraid to make lowball offers on stuff at the pawnshop.

Another benefit of an air drill - no sparks from the motor. If the drill bit causes sparks you have other problems. Helps if you're drilling near flammable liquids or vapors.

[RCP Phx]

I love my right angle air drill because it fits into places a normal drill can't get to.

[yossarian19]

Your compressor / tank isn't the issue.
For impact wrenches... every mechanic I know swears by the Ingersol Rand 231. (http://www.amazon.com/Ingersoll-Rand-IR-231-2-Inch-Impact-Wrench/dp/B00004XOSJ) Its the one with a metal case that they've been dropping, forgetting to oil & beating on for 25 years or so, without ever re building it. I've got a Ti series gun, IR's "high end", and have already rebuilt it once. Been using it 4 years or so.
Rachet wise... Snap On makes this (https://buy1.snapon.com/catalog/item.asp?P65=yes&tool=power&item_ID=72222&group_ID=19894&store=snapon-store&dir=catalog) guy but it's super expensive. I recomend whatever ratchet you decide to spend your life with has the direction reverse switch somewhere other than the head of the tool. The first time you back a bolt out and pin your ratchet against something else, finding yourself unable to put it back in drive, you'll wish you'd bought something else.

[iwannadie]

What type of oil/grease would you guys recommend for my IR thunder gun? I looked and looked, I see that IR sells an oil/grease kit. The kit lists all the models it's for but it doesn't match the thunder gun model number specifically. Also the oil isn't the correct #(weight) oil either as is recommended in the thunder gun manual.

I've been using a bottle of craftsman all purpose air tool oil but I would rather put the best I can in it so it lasts. Also with the grease I'd like to get the IR mini grease gun and grease to keep up on that. I am either dense or blind because I am just not seeing the proper IR lube kit. I don't want to buy the wrong one either at 30 bucks it's not a cheapy.

[yossarian19]

I wouldn't worry about it too much. I've known guys to use ATF, DEX, pneumatic oil, etc - as long as you oil it before a day's use, its no big deal.

[alex22]

I love my right angle air drill because it fits into places a normal drill can't get to.

Its hard to beat a right angle air drill for those tight places.

I've known people who barley took care of their air tools (no grease or oil) for months at a time for years while still using them every day in dirty environments and the tools last a few years under the worst conditions. I would say that a few drops of a light oil (tool oil) prior to use will keep the seals and bearings happy for a long time.

[WebDog]

The air drills are much louder than a corded drill, but have less torque which can be nice for some jobs. The tools I use for crack repair and tapping holes are pneumatic so they are less likely to break off a drill or tap in a block or head. I use an electric drill, corded or cordless for any other job I have to do.

Another reason you see a lot of mechanics using air drills is that most shops are set up with drop lines for air and not extension cords.

The Snap-on air drill i have used has way more torque then my half inch dewalt drill, it tried to rip my arms off a few times. and it was much quieter, so it might depend on what brand / price drill you get.

[JAS]

I try to put a few drops of oil in the tools after use... They are ready for next time and if there are moisture it is also taken care of.

[iwannadie]

I'm still adding to my air tools pile, which is growing nicely.

Can anyone recommend an Ingersoll Rand air hammer? I am sticking with ingersoll rand for this so please no harbor freight cheerleading ;) .

I am looking at the various models; standard, medium, server duty. Are the duty levels a gauge of how much force they put out or more of how durable they are? I would like something that kicks pretty hard but it is not something I will be using for hours at a time. Should I just go medium duty and call it done or spend the extra and go severe?

[Jeepman401]

Go with the severe duty. I dont have a Ingersoll air hammer, but looking at the differences online, the severe duty looks like it has similar specs to my snap on

[iwannadie]

Go with the severe duty. I dont have a Ingersoll air hammer, but looking at the differences online, the severe duty looks like it has similar specs to my snap on

Thanks for the input. The specs I see are all just BPM I wish they had like a power scale of how much force each one can put out or something like impact guns.

[iwannadie]

I went with the super(severe) duty one. Amazon had that and the standard duty on sale. I almost bought the standard duty one they had for 25 bucks($75 msrp) but it sold out over night. So, I stepped up and got the super duty for $85 ($150 msrp).

I wish it came with the chisel hammer attachment thought that's what I need most.

[2stix]

i think i read through it all and didn't see any mention of using a larger coupler (quick connect). even with a 3/8 hose the coupler is the smallest diameter. if you feel your gun isn't up to strength try using a larger coupler. plus the length of hose will have a big effect on air volume/pressure.

advantage of air drill? often smaller than most drills, can be used under water (for those of us that work on boats that sat in the rain). and others that have been mentioned.

brands of air tools? i have alot of cheap ones that i take apart and clean and keep going strong. but a good quality gun is a good idea since that is the one mostly used and needed to perform at its best. oil them often. allthough i am very bad at not oiling them and abusing them very badly. i leave them in the yard, drag them through the dirt (no concrete at my place), heck i have even used spit instead of oil. yes i abuse them bad. but after i take it apart and clean them up again they allways seem to work well. i still have some air tools i bought when i was 16. i am 45 now. cheap air tools, but still going strong. so if anyone has tested the cheap tools, its me. that said, i would like to get a good quality 1/2" impact so i can start taking care of them better. i figure a new "good" tool will help me change my ways....lol

[iwannadie]

Has anyone used this U-Joint (http://www.lislecorp.com/divisions/products/?product=549&division=1&category=6) air hammer bit? It looks interesting the way you apply the force to the yoke rather than the u-joint. It has good reviews on google but curious if anyone here has experience with it.

[iwannadie]

I went with the super(severe) duty one. Amazon had that and the standard duty on sale. I almost bought the standard duty one they had for 25 bucks($75 msrp) but it sold out over night. So, I stepped up and got the super duty for $85 ($150 msrp).

I wish it came with the chisel hammer attachment thought that's what I need most.

I got my air hammer and fired it up today, this thing is a beast no question. I only have the bits that came with it so I used a flat blade to remove the C clips off some very old and rusty u-joints. It sent the c clips flying off without any effort at all. I wasn't ready the first attempt and put a few nice chips into my garage floor too ha.

I ran it as per instruction before using for a few seconds and it was enough to make my whole hand numb from the vibrations. I can't wait to get an actually hammer bit and go to town on the old rusty u-joints.

I'd like to add a quick change adapter too, the spring isn't difficult to deal with but might as well make it easier.

[Jeepman401]

Thats why I love my snap on air hammer. It transfers almost no vibrations back to you.
I do recommend switching to a quick change adapter. I have seen way to many springs break to trust them

[iwannadie]

Thats why I love my snap on air hammer. It transfers almost no vibrations back to you.
I do recommend switching to a quick change adapter. I have seen way to many springs break to trust them

Well, to be fair I used it for about 30 seconds non stop and it was like 30 degrees in my garage so my hands were ice ha. When I used it to knock the C clips off there wasn't any issue with vibrations.

Isn't the quick change just a spring inside a coupler, the spring can still break? I read some where that a lot of people breaking springs was because it was over tightened. Someone posted they contacted IR and were told to tighten the spring, then back it off 1 turn. He claimed that solved his constant breaking issue. I do still want to get a quick change though.

[iwannadie]

Does anyone know where I can buy Legacy Color connex air couplers? I am looking just for the 1/4 male fittings to add to my tools. I bought the kit with the couplers and chucks now I just need additional couplers. Everyone seems to only sell the whole kits and I have no use for them...

[Jeepman401]

Well, to be fair I used it for about 30 seconds non stop and it was like 30 degrees in my garage so my hands were ice ha. When I used it to knock the C clips off there wasn't any issue with vibrations.

Isn't the quick change just a spring inside a coupler, the spring can still break? I read some where that a lot of people breaking springs was because it was over tightened. Someone posted they contacted IR and were told to tighten the spring, then back it off 1 turn. He claimed that solved his constant breaking issue. I do still want to get a quick change though.
Most quick connects are just like a female air line fitting, so spring to break

[Dundy]

I know i'm a little late to the conversation but:

Best Air Hammer: http://www.sjdiscounttools.com/cp717.html

Favorite Air Hamer Bit: http://buy1.snapon.com/catalog/item.asp?P65=&tool=power&item_ID=72759&group_ID=864&store=snapon-store&dir=catalog

The air hammer has a .498 shank instead of the .401 shank so a special bit is needed. However, that air hammer can unstuck EVERYTHING! I've seen ball joints that a press can't budge get removed with ease with that air hammer.

The bit is awesome for loosening tapers (tie rod ends, ball joints, etc.)