d30 pinion bearing

[87manche]

so, I just discovered that my driveline vibe was from the pinion bearing having 1/8" of play front to beack and side to side.
What entails replacement?
Will the gears have to be completely setup again?
Pinion and ring are not damaged, it just needs an overhaul.
Ideally I'd like to hear that I can pull the pinion, put a new beaing in place and stick it back together again, but I doubt thats the case.
If I were to replace both pinion bearings and replace them with shims measureig the same thickness as the old ones is there a chance that the gear pattern will be right?

[KarlVP]

Pinion bearing preload is one of the biggest pains in the butt to get. If you want to replace those bearings you are going to have to pull the carrier, then pull the pinion out, and replace the bearings.

On the D30 HP front the shims are between the inner bearing race and the housing. You can measure that shim pack and replace with new. Reason being is most of the time when you tap out the race, it messes up the shim pack. Get that pinion preload back to normal and you should be fine. It really isn't AS crucial as the rear, because you aren't driving with your front end all the time.

I would say 75% of the time, if you replace the shims with like ones, you will be correct. For instance, when I replaced my lockright with a detroit, I only had to move the carrier over .003" that changed my b/l from about .017 to .012. Right in the groove.

I hope this answered your question.

[twisted_ed]

this is easy for you:
-remove axle shaft.
-remove diff cover
-remove carrier bearing caps (mark them left and right and top and bottom so they go in correct
-remove carrier and bearing cups making sure you mark left and right bearing cups.
-If you dont have a inch pound dial torque wrench, get a spring scale and wind some string around the pinion yoke where it meets the seal. then attach the scale to the string and pull. record the rolling resistance of the spring scale, so you can duplicate this later.
-Remove the pinion nut and discard and get a new one
-remove the seal and replace with a new one.
- tap on the end of the pinion with a rubber mallet to knock loose the pinion
(hold it from the inside.)
-remove the pinion from the housing.
-remove the other pinion bearing from the other side wherre the yoke is.
-look inside you should see the shim pack... hold onto it with one hand and pull it out (remove the shim pack.)
-remove both bearing cups from the housing using a brass punch (so you dont damage anything)
-remove the pressed on pinion bearing either having a machine shop do it (best method) or heat or cut it off.
-inspect the depth shim beneath the bearing just removed in the above step. if its damaged, measure and replace with new or resuse if its ok and press new bearing on.
-install new bearing cups in the housing using a brass punch
-install pinion into housing, install shims onto pinion, install new bearing.
-install yoke onto pinion (tap it on if it wont fit cause you need to tap the bearing down with it) use old nut and tight down untill you cant anymore.
-install the string and spring scale and check the preload. if its what it was before you are pretty close. Remember looser is better cause everything heats up and expands so you dont want it to get tight just as long as there is no end play. If it needs to be tighter take away from the shim pack, if it needs to be tighter, add to the shim pack.
-once the preload is good, remove the nut, and yoke, install new seal and install yoke and new nut. tighten down.
-installl carrier, carrier cups, caps, cover, shafts, oil and ur ready to go.

[87manche]

ok.
I can get an inch pound dial wrench from the guy that halped me reset the backlash on the 35 when I installed a Detroit.
So, I'll need to order both pinion bearings and a shim kit. Will the shim kit include shims needed for the pinion and the carrier? Don't want to have it torn apart and need a silly little shim.
Also, I don't want to drive on it in this condition, so I was going to pull the front driveshaft and the carrier and the pinion.
If I remove the inners and leave the outers can I drive on the axle. The unit bearing takes all the load from the wheel correct? I'll plug the tubes and leave it like a 2wd beam axle.

[KarlVP]

Yup, that's the best way to do it. Leave the outers.

I even have a set of outers that are broken so I can slide them in there, just in case.

[Rawbrown]

couple things...
-remove carrier bearing caps (mark them left and right and top and bottom so they go in correct
Dana spicer axles are allready marked for you. just look for the letter stamping that corosponds between the cover gasket surface and the cap. on one side hte letter is up and down. on the other cap they simply turn the letter 90 degrees. its not rocket science.
-record the rolling resistance of the spring scale, so you can duplicate this later.
pinion bearings are shot. your not going to get a valid reading. new bearing should be 12-18 inch pounds on the pinion only. youll find somewhere around .065" to .070" of pinion preload shims. just don't install the pinion seal till you figure out the correct amount of shims under the pinion.
-remove the other pinion bearing from the other side wherre the yoke is.
but you just told him to put the new seal in.
-Remember looser is better cause everything heats up and expands so you dont want it to get tight just as long as there is no end play.
This is poor advice. looser is not allways better. There is a preload spec for a reason and it was engineering taking into account heat. To loose of a bearing allows for deflection in the gears causing causing premature bearing and gear failure.

Yes you can drive on the outers only. no problem.
On many D30's there are no shims under the inner pinion bearing cup other than the stepped oil baffle. pinion depth duties fall into the hands of the oil slinger that is pressed on to the pinion with the inner pinion bearing cone. It should measure in the .065" range +/-...

[falcon556]

I only had to move the carrier over .003" that changed my b/l from about .017 to .012. Right in the groove.

I hope this answered your question.
Isn't .012 a bit high? The manual says .005-.008"

[87manche]

couple things...
-remove carrier bearing caps (mark them left and right and top and bottom so they go in correct
Dana spicer axles are allready marked for you. just look for the letter stamping that corosponds between the cover gasket surface and the cap. on one side hte letter is up and down. on the other cap they simply turn the letter 90 degrees. its not rocket science.
-record the rolling resistance of the spring scale, so you can duplicate this later.
pinion bearings are shot. your not going to get a valid reading. new bearing should be 12-18 inch pounds on the pinion only. youll find somewhere around .065" to .070" of pinion preload shims. just don't install the pinion seal till you figure out the correct amount of shims under the pinion.
-remove the other pinion bearing from the other side wherre the yoke is.
but you just told him to put the new seal in.
-Remember looser is better cause everything heats up and expands so you dont want it to get tight just as long as there is no end play.
This is poor advice. looser is not allways better. There is a preload spec for a reason and it was engineering taking into account heat. To loose of a bearing allows for deflection in the gears causing causing premature bearing and gear failure.

Yes you can drive on the outers only. no problem.
On many D30's there are no shims under the inner pinion bearing cup other than the stepped oil baffle. pinion depth duties fall into the hands of the oil slinger that is pressed on to the pinion with the inner pinion bearing cone. It should measure in the .065" range +/-...
Thanks for the measurements Ryan.
I'm delving into the axle this weekend. Decided I wasn't going to make it to redbird and I didn't want to rush a gear setup and toast the whole assembly.

[falcon556]

couple things....

He got his info, I'd like to ask you something.
Got a D30 in a '96. Worked great.
Installed Truetrac, backlash .0075", tooth pattern great.
It started howling between 30-40 mph
What did I do wrong? I can't figure this out, don't know how to fix it.

[KarlVP]

Isn't .012 a bit high? The manual says .005-.008"


Which Manufacturer?

And also, was your spec for a new or used gearset?

[falcon556]

Which Manufacturer?

And also, was your spec for a new or used gearset?

Jeep FSM. They did not mention new or used.
I messed with mine, I put the backlash to .0075, just shy of .008"
which I took as the high limit, it makes noise, I was thinking about reducing it and then I see your post with the .012 limit.

[87manche]

so, I've gotten it all apart, seems that only the outer bearing is borked. Unfortunately I mangled what I believe to be the oil slinger. That is what sits just behind the inner bearing correct?
need to find a replacement quick.
At least I didn't f the shims all up, so I can measure those.

[87manche]

ok, turns out that part is the inner bearing oil baffle. No more problem there.
Biggest problem right now is the outer bearing race. I can't get it out of the housing. I don't want to go whacking away at it with a chisel and hammer to pop it. Anybody have any tricks to get it out? Some kind of reverse puller or something?

[falcon556]

ok, turns out that part is the inner bearing oil baffle. No more problem there.
Biggest problem right now is the outer bearing race. I can't get it out of the housing. I don't want to go whacking away at it with a chisel and hammer to pop it. Anybody have any tricks to get it out? Some kind of reverse puller or something?

I just did that in a D44 axle. I used a steel punch. I ground the tip to get exactly 90 degrees so that it will not slip.
Worked great.

[langer1]

so, I just discovered that my driveline vibe was from the pinion bearing having 1/8" of play front to beack and side to side.
What entails replacement?
Will the gears have to be completely setup again?
Pinion and ring are not damaged, it just needs an overhaul.
Ideally I'd like to hear that I can pull the pinion, put a new beaing in place and stick it back together again, but I doubt thats the case.
If I were to replace both pinion bearings and replace them with shims measureig the same thickness as the old ones is there a chance that the gear pattern will be right?

Are you sure the nuts not loose? Those are tappered bearings.

[langer1]

ok, turns out that part is the inner bearing oil baffle. No more problem there.
Biggest problem right now is the outer bearing race. I can't get it out of the housing. I don't want to go whacking away at it with a chisel and hammer to pop it. Anybody have any tricks to get it out? Some kind of reverse puller or something?

Punch it out from the back.

[87manche]

Are you sure the nuts not loose? Those are tappered bearings.
nut wasn't loose, took the impact to get it off.
Outer bearing is toast, so it had sideplay.

Got the outer bearing race out using an old thermostat in my 36MM hub nut socket, took about 3 whacks.

Was well on the way to putting it back together, parts store gave me the wrong bearings.
Apparently there was a changeover in the 97-98 year, 98's have different bearings.
Parts store computer says that the 98 bearings are for the 97.
So now I'm screwed, won't have bearing until tomorrow morning.
Should have ordered it from desertfab, and I wouldn't be in this position.
Note to self, don't trust parts store anymore.
second note, order from vendors on the board that know WTF they're talking about.

[87manche]

ok, got the pinion back in.
Bearing preload is 15lbs.
backlash is a little high @.010, but this is a used gearset.
Pattern looks good, I'm gonna run it.
Thanks for the help everyone, this was my first time hardcore into the differential.

[falcon556]

Which Manufacturer?

And also, was your spec for a new or used gearset?

I just pulled the ring and pinion off a Dana 44. The teeth on both are mirror finish with no wear visible.
When I put them back together, should the backlash be higher?
Why?

[87manche]

I would imagine that a used gearset is going to be a little higher from wear.
I decided to leave mine, as the preload was good, and that was using the shims that came out of it. The pattern looked good, so I decided to roll with it. Time will tell as to whether or not I've made a catastrophic mistake.

[KarlVP]

I just pulled the ring and pinion off a Dana 44. The teeth on both are mirror finish with no wear visible.
When I put them back together, should the backlash be higher?
Why?


Put them back together the way you pulled them apart.