Neutral Safety Switch Problem

[klway29]

I just put in a new nss last week and drove today for the first time and I have no overdrive. I searched and realized I may need to realign the switch. Can anybody let me know if this sounds right?

[Flyfisher]

Don't know why you would want to put in a new one...with all sorts of threads on here about how to clean them and save hundreds of $$. I cleaned mine a few weeks ago to solve a back-up light problem and, if I remember correctly, the alignment is not adjustable.

[5-90]

The alignment is slightly adjustable - but I don't have any FSMs handy. That's what the upper screw is for tho - and why it goes into a "sector" or "slot" rather than a round hole.

Do you still have the old NSS? I'd like to see if I can get that from you...

5-90

[klway29]

Well I had the intentions of cleaning mine after I got it off, but the switch broke when I tried to pry it off and the threads stripped off in the process also...I still tried to take it apart and clean it, but I had one of the 2 springs that hold the 2 contacts in pop out on me...thats what I get for trying to do this in the dark. I was soo pissed off, I threw away the old one and ordered a new off Ebay for $146. I put this new one on and the check engine light is still on, and I don't have overdrive now which sucks cause I'm running 32 inch tires and driving about 50 miles one way to work. I only drive the jeep about once a week to work, but not having overdrive is a big deal for me. Any other help would be greatly appreciated.

[5-90]

Not a huge issue - I'll probably end up breaking the thing anyhow. I just need to measure out a pattern or two...

5-90

[klway29]

Does anyone know if I need to reprogram my ECM or my TCM with the new Neutral Safety Switch? Could this be the reason that I don't have overdrive with the new one? Thanks for any advise on this!!!

[5-90]

You should not need to.

I have a copy of the AW4 ATSG service manual on this hard drive somewhere - and it's got a troubleshooting section. If you want it, ping my email (dragonland2001 AT yahoo DOT com) and I'll send it your way. Might take me a bit, but I'm sure it's here somewhere....

5-90

[Saudade]

If you can crank the starter with the shifter in neutral, then the NSS is adjusted OK. Maybe you knocked something else loose while changing it. There's a similar connector for the trans near the NSS connector. Did you split that one too? If so, try disconnecting and reconnecting it.

[klway29]

Ok...my Jeep will only start in park. I guess I need to take off the nss and adjust it accordingly. Thanks again guys!

[Big Red]

Well if you Jeep didn't start, and you know your battery isn't totally dead, turning the key and jiggling the auto shifter in park does the trick as well, at least for awhile. I don't know long term, sometimes my Jeep doesn't want to start, and this has always worked me me on many Jeeps.

[Saudade]

Ok...my Jeep will only start in park. I guess I need to take off the nss and adjust it accordingly. Thanks again guys!

You don't need to take it off. You just need to adjust it.

http://www1.autozone.com/servlet/UiBroker?ForwardPage=/az/cds/en_us/0900823d/80/15/40/44/0900823d80154044.jsp

[Flyfisher]

Hello...with 32" tires...why do you need OD? I quit using OD when I had 31s...only reasonable when downhill with a tail wind. I have 33's now...and don't even THINK about OD. I know i need to re-gear the diffs..but that will come.

But...I do understand your issue...the tranny won't shift into OD..even if you shouldn't be using it!

[klway29]

Thanks for all the advise guys. I'll try adjusting it tonight when I get in from work. Not having overdrive did make a big difference in my drive to work. Usually my Jeep uses about a 1/4 tank of gas to get to and from work, and the other day it took just over 1/2 a tank to get to and from work. Thanks again for the help guys.

[PatriotJeep]

I'm running 33x12.50x15 Muds and my '93 shifts into Overdrive all the time on the highway. It did this even before I had the gears changed to 4.56's. The OD is a lot better on the gas mileage, but most important, it's not overworking the 4.0, trani, etc. Plus, the 4.56's are great both ON and OFF road.

[langer1]

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v11/langer1/jeep/FSM/aw4txt.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v11/langer1/jeep/FSM/fig4.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v11/langer1/jeep/FSM/fig5.jpg

[Blaine B.]

There's supposed to be a mark, but on older XJ's you probably won't be able to find it. After cleaning mine, we just shifted into park and adjusted the NSS until the reverse lights came on. Works fine!

[Saudade]

we just shifted into park and adjusted the NSS until the reverse lights came on. Works fine!

Did you mean you shifted into reverse?

[Blaine B.]

Yes, stupid typo.

[UNCC_99XJ]

Just ran into this problem on my friends 97. He took the switch off to clean it and try to get his reverse lights back last weekend. Put the switch back on, and it only starts in Park. The check engine light is on and is throwing 3 codes, Transmission Control Error (P0700), Transmission sensor malfunction (P0705) and the same P0705 only it's listed as "pending".

I am a little confused as to how to properly adjust it so we can get it functioning properly and I can turn the CEL off and have it stay off. According to this link that was posted: http://www1.autozone.com/az/cds/en_us/0900823d/80/15/40/44/0900823d80154044/repairInfoPages.htm

I see the adjustment BOLT, and the attaching NUT, however I do not see an ADJUSTMENT NUT, unless they are talking about the bolt at the top right. Which do I losen? I would assume the part that I am going to be rotating is the "shaft" that the switch sits on, so I would think that it's the nut that I am wanting to losen. I do see the line that my FSM mentions as the "neutral line".

My other question is, does the shift linkage really need to be disconnected for the adjustment to work? I cannot understand why, as it's on the complete opposite side of the transmission as the NSS.

Any help yall can give is MUCH appreciated. We spent a good hour and a half today trying to get it to work properly with no luck.

The Jeep in question here is a 97, 4.0, AW4, 150,000ish miles on it IIRC.

One other thing that I noticed today is that the gear shifter is extremely hard to move between gears, which didn't happen until after he re-installed it from cleaning it. By this I mean it take a good bit of force to get it to move into any gear selection, however the transmission still shifts between normally. I would assume that this is in relation to the NSS being out of adjustment, but I fear otherwise.

I've cleaned the NSS on a 98 before and had absolutely no issues such as this, and I didn't have to take the shift linkage off to remove and re-install the switch (as the above instructions also mention)

[5-90]

Both. The collet nut (around the shift shaft) is the primary retention, and there is a sector that the upper screw goes through - which provides a range of adjustment.

Loosen both slightly, then adjust. Tighten the upper screw slightly when you think you've got it, and check it out.

When you're got it set, the collet nut gets torqued to 5 pound-feet (61 pound-inches, actually. Do not overtighten!) I don't recall the torque for the adjuster screw, but it's on my website if you look.

[UNCC_99XJ]

Thanks Jon, I'll talk with him and see when he wants to mess with it some more.

So am I correct in saying that the shift linkage does NOT need to be disconnected?

So it looks like I losen both the bolt and the nut, and rotate the switch so that the vertical grove on the shaft is aligned with the vertical line on the switch, then re-tighten everything. Sounds simple enough....too bad we couldn't get it figured out today.

Still confused about why it's so hard to move the gear shift between selections.

Don't have a torque wrench (on my birthday list for a couple of weeks from now :D ), so gonna have to go against the proper thing to do and guesstimate.

[BBeach]

Welcome to my past 2 months of hell, I messed around with it the other weekend and finally got it to start in neutral and park, and I did some "modifications" to get my 1-2 gear back.

[BBeach]

And its tough to shift gears because the adjusting bolt is too tight, what I did was have my friend shift through the gears to see if it felt right, then stopped when it was good there and when I could shift into 1-2 and start in Neutral and Park.....however it still wont "click, snap" whatever into the 1-2 position. Theres a piece of metal on the shifter that hits the "housing", i'll try to get up pics from that weekend.

[BBeach]

My typical lousy paint interpretation....but from what I get out of it the "1" basically the white thing is what needs to be disconnected? And the two lower things I circled used to hit (well still do) so I got a little angry and took the dremel to the lower oval and grinded just a tiny bit away, and now I can get into the lower gear. Im pretty sure it wasnt the best idea Ive come up with but it got the job done, though it still doesnt click into gear. :smsoap:
http://memimage.cardomain.net/member_images/1/web/793000-793999/793834_56_full.jpg

[5-90]

Thanks Jon, I'll talk with him and see when he wants to mess with it some more.

So am I correct in saying that the shift linkage does NOT need to be disconnected?

So it looks like I losen both the bolt and the nut, and rotate the switch so that the vertical grove on the shaft is aligned with the vertical line on the switch, then re-tighten everything. Sounds simple enough....too bad we couldn't get it figured out today.

Still confused about why it's so hard to move the gear shift between selections.

Don't have a torque wrench (on my birthday list for a couple of weeks from now :D ), so gonna have to go against the proper thing to do and guesstimate.

Correct. If you give me some time, I can probably find a "truth table" for what outputs are connected in what gear range - then you could check thoroughly with a continuity checker of some type (you'll need it to be powered - the continuity test function on any DMM will serve neatly.) Since you can check from up top, with the NSS connector disconnected from the harness - that may be easiest.

[lawsoncl]

Still confused about why it's so hard to move the gear shift between selections.


You need to snug up the adjusting bolt first, give the switch a tap or two then tighten the collet nut. If you do it the other way around, you XXXX the switch a little on the shaft and it gets hard to shift. Also wears out the switch faster.

[UNCC_99XJ]

Awesome...this is great to know as I can see how it's can easily be put out of adjustment when cleaning it.

He had to take it to the shop today to get the a/c recharged (imagine that!) and was going to have them see if they could adjust it while they had it in there, depending on cost. But this is definitely good to know for the future.

Jon, I would like that "table", when ever you have a moment, no rush.

BBeach, thanks for your help as well. I figured it was probably tha bolt that was on too tight. Like I said I don't have a torque wrench, so we had to guesstimate as to how tight to make it.

Nothin like workin on a Jeep in the dorm parking lot with limited tools right? :gee:

[5-90]

Awesome...this is great to know as I can see how it's can easily be put out of adjustment when cleaning it.

He had to take it to the shop today to get the a/c recharged (imagine that!) and was going to have them see if they could adjust it while they had it in there, depending on cost. But this is definitely good to know for the future.

Jon, I would like that "table", when ever you have a moment, no rush.

BBeach, thanks for your help as well. I figured it was probably tha bolt that was on too tight. Like I said I don't have a torque wrench, so we had to guesstimate as to how tight to make it.

Nothin like workin on a Jeep in the dorm parking lot with limited tools right? :gee:

Always assume the next poor schmuck to work on your rig will be you, and you'll be doing it with a Swiss Army Knife and an ax. Plan accordingly.

Anyhow...

Looking into the "terminal end", with the retaining latch on TOP, and contacts identified thus:
(LATCH)
E F G H
D C B A

In Park, continuity exists between B and C ONLY (B-C)
In Reverse, A-E
In Neutral, B-C
In Drive - no continuity between any terminals
In Third, A-G
In First/Second, A-H

- Source: 1999FSM

[UNCC_99XJ]

Always assume the next poor schmuck to work on your rig will be you, and you'll be doing it with a Swiss Army Knife and an ax. Plan accordingly.

Anyhow...

Looking into the "terminal end", with the retaining latch on TOP, and contacts identified thus:
(LATCH)
E F G H
D C B A

In Park, continuity exists between B and C ONLY (B-C)
In Reverse, A-E
In Neutral, B-C
In Drive - no continuity between any terminals
In Third, A-G
In First/Second, A-H

- Source: 1999FSM
LOL I have a FSM for my 99 which is what I was using to try and adjust the stupid thing, didn't see that table in there though...will have to give it another look. Thanks!

[5-90]

LOL I have a FSM for my 99 which is what I was using to try and adjust the stupid thing, didn't see that table in there though...will have to give it another look. Thanks!

Page 21-183, if I'm remembering that number correctly. It's in Section 21 - Transmission and Transfer Case, under the AW4 (and fairly early in the section.)