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35 spline kit for stock xj D44

N

NorStar

NAXJA Forum User
Location
MA
I think many of you have upgraded your '87-'89 xj D44 to 35 spline with ARB RD109.
Did you guys purchase this as a kit? Alloy USA has a kit called "Dana 44 Mas Grande 35-Spline Kit With ARB Locker #12137-ARB". But they only list it for '97-'06 TJ. I thought TJ and XJ D44 are the same? I must be missing something. Can someone please explain? Thanks!
 
They are the same, the only difference is if the kit comes with the bearing and retaining plates pressed on, the TJ's and XJ's use different plates.
 
X2,it does come with the bearing retaining plates
 
and now instead of breaking shafts you break ring and pinions
 
ktm racer 419 said:
and now instead of breaking shafts you break ring and pinions
Click to expand...

Examples?

Anything can break, but a low pinion D44 gear set in the back can take quite a bit of abuse, much more abuse in most cases than the 30 spline axles. If you're going to spend the money for a locker and alloy shafts in a D44 it sure as hell makes a lot of sense to go with 35 spline shafts. You'll basically never break a shaft.

In a rear high pinion D60, you're also more likely to break a ring and pinion than an alloy 35 spline shaft, but everyone still wants 35 spline shafts. One good thing is that most ring and pinion failures are a few broken teeth, and you can still drive the rig. You might even run it awhile with broken teeth and not know it. But, breaking an axle shaft on the trail means an immediate repair. I'd much rather risk the ring and pinion.
 
Goatman said:
Examples?

Anything can break, but a low pinion D44 gear set in the back can take quite a bit of abuse, much more abuse in most cases than the 30 spline axles. If you're going to spend the money for a locker and alloy shafts in a D44 it sure as hell makes a lot of sense to go with 35 spline shafts. You'll basically never break a shaft.

In a rear high pinion D60, you're also more likely to break a ring and pinion than an alloy 35 spline shaft, but everyone still wants 35 spline shafts. One good thing is that most ring and pinion failures are a few broken teeth, and you can still drive the rig. You might even run it awhile with broken teeth and not know it. But, breaking an axle shaft on the trail means an immediate repair. I'd much rather risk the ring and pinion.
Click to expand...

Sure if you want a full case locker, I agree, It would be tempting to get the 35-spline stuff. I don't know that I would though. I'd probably get 33-spline.

My 30-spline superior evos have held up to everything I've managed to throw at them on 35s. I'm honestly beginning to worry about the stock carrier or locker(4.88s and no-slip). I just don't see the need for 35-spline stuff in a rear D44...maybe 33-spline.

A rear HP60 would already be setup for 35-spline. No need to buy a new carrier. So that's understandable.

I know what you mean about the broken teeth. My dad's 8.75 in his hemi challenger could be driven around like normal when he chipped off 2 teeth from the ring gear. However, my D30 would lock up left and right when 5 teeth were gone from the ring gear.

Bryan C. said:
Letterman proved that the 1310 driveshaft u-joint is the weak link when running a 35 spline D44.
Click to expand...

Vetteboy runs 1310s with a D60/14B and I'm pretty sure hasn't busted one, but has blown up D60 parts. I'll let him chime in on that though if he feels like it.
 
Goatman said:
Examples?

.
Click to expand...

myself

pics are somewhere on the internet

i ran 33 spline moser alloy shafts in an ox locker with yukon 5.38's

i was 350 miles from home and couldnt drive on it.

gears were installed by a reputable shop (not some backyard hack)
 
To clarify, if you know you want a full case locker then it isn't much more money to get the 35 spline unit.

I personally wouldn't trust a rear D44 on anything more than 35-36s locked with aftermarket shafts.

This is also just my opinion.
 
ktm racer 419 said:
i ran 33 spline moser alloy shafts in an ox locker with yukon 5.38's
Click to expand...

So you buy a set of cheap gears, they break, and now the 35 spline shafts are not good to buy because of that? I guess you now know why yukon gears are so inexpensive. You get what you pay for.

The real point is that if you run a D44 and run it hard it will probably break somewhere. There is a reason why D60's were invented.
 
My comment was only in regards to the negative comment about now you'll break the ring and pinion if you go with 35 spline shafts. Not nearly a good enough reason to not go 35 spline if you're replacing the locker and shafts anyway. Odds of getting off the trail with a broken ring and pinion are pretty good, odds of getting off the trail with a broken axle shaft are nil.

Yes, 33 spline would be enough, and for most good 30 spline shafts would be enough, but we've also seen plenty of 30 spline shafts break, with 35" and 36" tires. D44 ring and pinions can break, but it's pretty infrequent with the tire sizes most run with a D44. Personally, I swapped out the rear D44 I ran for a D60, I broke the D44 ring and pinion with 33" tires but I still drove it home. :)
 
Goatman said:
My comment was only in regards to the negative comment about now you'll break the ring and pinion if you go with 35 spline shafts. Not nearly a good enough reason to not go 35 spline if you're replacing the locker and shafts anyway. Odds of getting off the trail with a broken ring and pinion are pretty good, odds of getting off the trail with a broken axle shaft are nil.

Yes, 33 spline would be enough, and for most good 30 spline shafts would be enough, but we've also seen plenty of 30 spline shafts break, with 35" and 36" tires. D44 ring and pinions can break, but it's pretty infrequent with the tire sizes most run with a D44. Personally, I swapped out the rear D44 I ran for a D60, I broke the D44 ring and pinion with 33" tires but I still drove it home. :)
Click to expand...

100% agree with this :thumbup:
 
NorStar said:
Maybe low gearing/small pinion is a possible source of problem? :dunno:
Click to expand...


Bryan C. said:
So you buy a set of cheap gears, they break, and now the 35 spline shafts are not good to buy because of that? I guess you now know why yukon gears are so inexpensive. You get what you pay for.

.
Click to expand...

i was under the impression that yukon gears are decent (i know their shafts are garbage)

i have a LOW PINION front 44 with yukon 5.38's and have broken just about everything but the ring and pinion (detroit locker and enough alloy axle shafts to make a statue out of them)

i was always afraid of the ring and pinion strength up there because of what the internets told me about teenie pinions and being on the coast side of the gears and whatnot. mythbusted? or am i lucky?
 
Goatman said:
My comment was only in regards to the negative comment about now you'll break the ring and pinion if you go with 35 spline shafts. Not nearly a good enough reason to not go 35 spline if you're replacing the locker and shafts anyway. Odds of getting off the trail with a broken ring and pinion are pretty good, odds of getting off the trail with a broken axle shaft are nil.

Yes, 33 spline would be enough, and for most good 30 spline shafts would be enough, but we've also seen plenty of 30 spline shafts break, with 35" and 36" tires. D44 ring and pinions can break, but it's pretty infrequent with the tire sizes most run with a D44. Personally, I swapped out the rear D44 I ran for a D60, I broke the D44 ring and pinion with 33" tires but I still drove it home. :)
Click to expand...

i have seen more broken ring and pinions keep people from leaving a trail than broken shafts. i have also seen people open up their axles to find chipped ring gears and they would have never noticed.

but thats just from my experience, others may differ.

once i broke the ring and pinion in my 44 i went to a 60 as well.

this was run all on 35's to 37's with and without beadlocks
 
The thing is to not bounce them. I broke mine bouncing it hard. It's really not much different than all the guys running Toyota rear ends with 8" ring gears. Lot's of Toy running gear trucks and buggies with 38-40" tires and the gears hold up as long as they don't bounce them hard.

The same argument should be made then for low and high pinion D60's. HPD60's in the rear break ring and pinions pretty regularly, while low pinion 60's are virtually impossible to break. Yet, HPD60's are very popular for the rear. We can't have everything, so you choose your best compromise for the build that you want, and your driving style.

Mostly, shock loads break a ring and pinion, while binding usually breaks an axle. It's much easier to avoid shock loads than it is to avoid binding. If you're going to rock crawl, you're going to get your axles into binding situations. Obviously, you don't push it past what you think your axles can handle, but it's going to happen regularly if you're out there much. It's kind of amazing what a good quality 35 spline axle shaft can handle.
 
ktm racer 419 said:
i have a LOW PINION front 44 with yukon 5.38's and have broken just about everything but the ring and pinion (detroit locker and enough alloy axle shafts to make a statue out of them)

i was always afraid of the ring and pinion strength up there because of what the internets told me about teenie pinions and being on the coast side of the gears and whatnot. mythbusted? or am i lucky?
Click to expand...

Wait, a low pinion in the front is supposed to be weaker. :)

Not everyone buys into the smaller pinion is weaker theory. Some gear count combinations (various gear ratios) have more teeth contact than others, which is more important than the pinion size and really all that matters. Plus, the leverage increases slightly with the smaller pinion and lower ratio, so does that increase the strength? So who knows what the real deal is.
 
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