95 xj ax15????

[5spd_xj]

hey, i've got a 95 cherokee with the ax transmission. last week i had a problem with it...if if was in neutral, it didn't want to go into gear, and if it was in gear it sometimes wouldn't come out unless i forced it out. also, a couple times when i was stopped and had it in first, and had the clutch pedal all the way down, it felt like it was at the friction point and almost stalled. i pulled over and let it sit for awhile and when i started it it was ok for a while, then started acting up again. however, everytime this happened, i had been driving for a good half hour or maybe more. so, i drove it to the shop, and they drove it, but didn't get it to do the same thing (i'm assuming they didn't drive it for long enough ??). i described my problem, and he said it could possibly be either the pressure plate or slave cylinder. does this sound accurate?? he did bleed the slave cylinder, and its only happened to me once since, and i find that if i pump the clutch whenever i've got it in neutral it does alright. also, my clutch seems to be pretty good...it grabs pretty low, and doesn't slip. any ideas or suggestions? thanks in advance for any responses.

[Anthropy]

Sounds like the slave cylinder to me. If it was the clutch I don't think pumping the clutch would make the problem go away.

My slave cylinder went out a few years ago and I had similar symptoms.

Tom

[5spd_xj]

yeah, i was thinking the same thing. he said something about how you have to drop the transmission to get at it...yes or no?? i know older models had an internal slave cylinder, but aren't the 95s external? if so, how difficult of a job is it to do? do you have to drop the tranny regardless of internal or external? how much would it cost for me to do it myself, compared to a shop?

[otto]

I'm pretty sure 1995 and later AX-15's have an external slave cylinder, so you don't have to drop the tranny to replace it, much easier job than the older internal slave, which has a bleeder nipple. IIRC, the external setup has a closed line to the master cylinder with no bleeder.

If you have the external type you can do the job for less than $75; same for the internal, just a lot more work dropping the trans+transfer case.

[RichP]

If you buy the replacement it comes preassembled with the fluid already in it, don't open it up, just disconnet the old one at the firewall, bolt the new up, drop the slave thru and work the kinks out then do the bottom part to the tranny, careful that you don't route that line near the exhaust manifold so pay attention to how the old one was routed. The last couple we got we got from quadratec. One for a YJ and one for a TJ...

[5spd_xj]

hm... so would it be possible that i have the internal? just because the guy said he bled it...or could he have just bled the system somewhere else?

[RichP]

Crawl under and look, the slave is a cylinder on the drivers side thats near where the tranny and bell housing join. if you can see it then it's external, if you can't then it's internal, simple...
Or follow the the slaves master cylinder down from the drivers side firewall, that will lead you right to it..

[gradon]

I've had leaky valves in two master cylinders before and would have to double clutch to shift.

[ChiXJeff]

hm... so would it be possible that i have the internal? just because the guy said he bled it...or could he have just bled the system somewhere else?
The only way you'd have an internal slave is if an earlier (93 or older, IIRC) bellhousing was swapped in.

There is a screw head that looks like a bleeder screw on the back of the slave cylinder. I honestly don't know what it does, but it's not a bleeder. I've also heard that tinkering with it will damage the slave cylinder.

[5spd_xj]

alright, i looked underneath, and snapped a couple pics... i'll just post them and let you guys say what it is and isn't, if thats alright.

http://i38.photobucket.com/albums/e115/ihittreesalot/100_2947.jpg

http://i38.photobucket.com/albums/e115/ihittreesalot/100_2948.jpg

http://i38.photobucket.com/albums/e115/ihittreesalot/100_2949.jpg

[5spd_xj]

let me know if i'm in the right area... :-/....thanks agian for all the help, everyone

[bajacalal]

That is the external slave cylinder. Though you can buy it seperately and replace it (its held in by a roll pin) its much easier to buy the complete unit online like mentioned. That way, you won't have to mess around with bleeding and you can replace the master cylinder at the same time. I think they both wear out at around the same rate.

[Anthropy]

Yep, that is the slave cylinder. Pretty easy to change. Hardest part is making sure there is no air left in the lines.

[5spd_xj]

awesome, thanks. where can i get that kit, and what exactly does it include? thanks again

[sflier]

Yes, that is a one-piece master/slave cylinder. And that one (as it's sealed) can't be bleed so I'd suspect anyone who told you that they have bleed that system. Replace it with another sealed OEM style replacement (very easy to install) and you should be set.

[5spd_xj]

cool...should the master cylinder get replaced at the same time?

[SanDiegoXJ]

well here's my $0.02....

With my YJ, I lost the master cylinder twice..both times it went tho, you could tell it was leaking on the inside of the firewall where the plunger is the clutch pedal attaches to. Before rushing out and buying the whole kit, you might want to take a peak under the rug and see if you can find any brake fluid leaking anywhere.

it may not be your problem, but the master is SUPER easy to change (can't speak for the slave as mine was internal), no routing of lines...hardest part is hooking/unhooking the clutch pedal. but then again, I'm a cheap lazy bastard that won't replace anything I don't absolutely have to =)

[ChiXJeff]

SanDiegoXJ, it's just slightly different if your YJ had an internal slave. With that setup, you buy master, slave and lines separately. With the external slave, you get the entire thing as one preassembled unit. Also, with an external slave, you don't have to drop the transmission to swap the hydraulics.

[5spd_xj]

so, chixjeff, when i replace the slave, i'm replacing the master also? regardless of whether or not my problem is just the slave?

also...i haven't got the bill yet, but can somebody explain how it is impossible to bleed the external system, so that when i speak to the guy at the shop i'll have facts to argue with if he tries to tell me he bled it... thanks again

[sflier]

The master and the slave are one single piece for your year. Just replace the entire unit and you'll be set. You can purchase them as seperate units from the after-market but the price works out to be the same or more going that route. I'd suggest going with the OEM style single sealed (master and slave) unit. You won't have to worry about moisture getting into it or worry about bleeding it. It's called the "HYDRAULIC ASSEMBLY, Clutch Actuator" and is part #5210-4110 (replaces original part #5210-7701). You can get it from the dealer or save 15% or so by ordering online from http://allchryslerparts.com/. It's about $170.00 from the dealer.

[Matthew Currie]

Whether you go with the unit or the parts, it can be bled without a bleeder, at least in theory. As I understand it, the slave cylinder is designed so that it displaces a tiny bit more than the combined master cylinder and tubing. So you bleed it by manually compressing the slave cylinder all the way before mounting it, and then releasing it, making sure as you do so that it does not suck the reservoir dry. There is also a blind threaded hole in the slave cylinder, which if you're brave you might try drilling out to install a bleeder, but I'd try the first method first.

[5spd_xj]

alright, so it IS possible to bleed the system? i'm just wondering because i'm gonna be pissed if the guy tries to charge me for something he didn't/couldn't do.

[sflier]

It is not possible to bleed the integrated unit (i.e. stock master/slave combo you showed in your picture). It is a sealed unit. It does have a cap on the master but it isn't meant to be opened. There is no bleeder on the slave side of it. It's sealed. Just bolt it in and forget it. It's (generally) a good design and is very trouble-free. It's main weakeness is that the line between the master and the slave is some sort of high-temperature plastic and "can" be more easily broken (than metal) in off-road use. I've found them to be very durable however.

Bottom line, if they told you they bled that system, I'd ask how they did it.

[5spd_xj]

ok, thanks, thats what i'll do :)

[5spd_xj]

alright, well, i'm off to the shop now to talk with him and see whats up...he seems like a good guy, so it should work out alright, i hope... we'll see...

[5spd_xj]

alright, well, he advised me to try and replace the slave and see what happens...i just finished doing that about an hour ago, and it felt better at first, but if i let it idle for awhile in neutral, maybe for 10 minutes or so, when i go to put it in reverse (only reverse, its fine going into first) it grinds, like it did before, but not nearly as bad, and it will go into gear, but i'm not liking the grind noise it makes while going into gear. before i swapped out the slave, it could idle in neutral for 2 minutes, then grind like crazy and not go into reverse at all... anyone have any comments on the situation?????? thanks in advance...

[lawsoncl]

Having to "pump up" the clutch to get it to work sounds like a bad MASTER and not the slave. So yeah, replace both and be done with it.

[Lodi Jim]

Try tapping the throttle to rev up the motor slightly as you press in the clutch and move the shifter, this helps align the syncros.

[Matthew Currie]

Even with a good clutch linkage, there may be enough drag in the system for it to rotate the input shaft with the clutch down. The shaft will spin lazily, but with enough momentum to make a crunch when you shift into reverse, since there is no synchronizer to stop it before it tries to mesh. Try shifting briefly to a forward gear before putting it in reverse. Even if the problem is still in the clutch, this can help with the crunching.

[gradon]

I replaced the slave and master separately as it cost me under $100 w/o the hose, but I have the external slave and it was like an hour job for the two of them.

[5spd_xj]

yeah, i tried the giving it a little gas while the clutch is in and i put it in reverse...it seems to work pretty well. so this means its probably not my clutch, just the lack of a synchro, right?